Leinster Squad 21-22

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LeinsterLeader
Rhys Ruddock
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by LeinsterLeader »

jezzer wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 11:55 am I find it wild that it's in any way newsworthy.
I suppose the hope is someday stuff like this won't be.
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Oldschoolsocks
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by Oldschoolsocks »

LeinsterLeader wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 12:07 pm
jezzer wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 11:55 am I find it wild that it's in any way newsworthy.
I suppose the hope is someday stuff like this won't be.
It shouldn’t have to be, but it is.
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deco
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by deco »

Oldschoolsocks wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 12:39 pm
LeinsterLeader wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 12:07 pm
jezzer wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 11:55 am I find it wild that it's in any way newsworthy.
I suppose the hope is someday stuff like this won't be.
It shouldn’t have to be, but it is.

There's a big dollop of virtue signaling mixed in to be fair (the comments, not N McC).
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Oldschoolsocks
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by Oldschoolsocks »

I’m confused by the whole “virtue signalling” thing.

The man’s been through a rough time of it, he’s been supported by his teammates and club.

What do you mean by “virtue signalling in the comments”?
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Serb
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by Serb »

The comments around Nick are definitely not virtue signalling. It may be reasonably normalised to have your sexuality widely known in every day life, it’s anything but in the world of male professional sport.

You really don’t have to look too far back to see examples in other sports of how people were treated because of their sexuality. Justin Fashanu was barred from training with his team when Brian Clough found out about his sexuality.

Fashanu came out publicly in 1990 and was abused by teammates and crowds alike. The world has changed a lot since then but it has taken the full 32 years for another professional footballer in England to come out publicly.

People like Nick are risking a lot coming out while still in the public eye. Hopefully we can get to a point where it’s a non-issue, but we aren’t even close to that right now.
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by paddyor »

jezzer wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 11:55 am I find it wild that it's in any way newsworthy.
People have short memories
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by blockhead »

Serb wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 4:38 pm The comments around Nick are definitely not virtue signalling. It may be reasonably normalised to have your sexuality widely known in every day life, it’s anything but in the world of male professional sport.

You really don’t have to look too far back to see examples in other sports of how people were treated because of their sexuality. Justin Fashanu was barred from training with his team when Brian Clough found out about his sexuality.

Fashanu came out publicly in 1990 and was abused by teammates and crowds alike. The world has changed a lot since then but it has taken the full 32 years for another professional footballer in England to come out publicly.

People like Nick are risking a lot coming out while still in the public eye. Hopefully we can get to a point where it’s a non-issue, but we aren’t even close to that right now.
"People like Nick are risking a lot coming out while still in the public eye" Are they really?
By the reaction of all his teamates, his employers, his fans on here there was no risk to worry at all.
One of his own teamates came out only recently and was applauded.
He got the same reaction the likes of Nigel Owens and Gareth Thomas got years ago.
It didn't stop Leo Varadkar getting elected in his constituency time and again and becoming the leader of this country.

The reality is that most people don't care.
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Oldschoolsocks
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by Oldschoolsocks »

blockhead wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 6:22 pm
Serb wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 4:38 pm The comments around Nick are definitely not virtue signalling. It may be reasonably normalised to have your sexuality widely known in every day life, it’s anything but in the world of male professional sport.

You really don’t have to look too far back to see examples in other sports of how people were treated because of their sexuality. Justin Fashanu was barred from training with his team when Brian Clough found out about his sexuality.

Fashanu came out publicly in 1990 and was abused by teammates and crowds alike. The world has changed a lot since then but it has taken the full 32 years for another professional footballer in England to come out publicly.

People like Nick are risking a lot coming out while still in the public eye. Hopefully we can get to a point where it’s a non-issue, but we aren’t even close to that right now.
"People like Nick are risking a lot coming out while still in the public eye" Are they really?
By the reaction of all his teamates, his employers, his fans on here there was no risk to worry at all.
One of his own teamates came out only recently and was applauded.
He got the same reaction the likes of Nigel Owens and Gareth Thomas got years ago.
It didn't stop Leo Varadkar getting elected in his constituency time and again and becoming the leader of this country.

The reality is that most people don't care.
The bit you’re missing blocky is the piece right at the start of the article where he says:

NMcC: It has. I came out to my teammates in January and I was obviously pretty nervous about doing so, but I’m really happy that I did it.

I struggled with coming out for a while and it was starting to impact on me and my happiness so it was the right decision.

MÓB: How bad did that struggle get?

NMcC: It affected me so much that I agonised over my future and contemplated walking away from rugby altogether because I just didn’t think I could come out while playing rugby.

But, I spoke to Leo (Cullen) and Stuart (Lancaster) last November and the support that I got from them straight away was unbelievable. They helped and guided me over the months that followed so that I felt more comfortable to come out to the group.
So if you walk across the main road without looking left or right and don’t get hit by a car that doesn’t mean there was no risk involved…
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munster#1
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by munster#1 »

blockhead wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 6:22 pm
Serb wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 4:38 pm The comments around Nick are definitely not virtue signalling. It may be reasonably normalised to have your sexuality widely known in every day life, it’s anything but in the world of male professional sport.

You really don’t have to look too far back to see examples in other sports of how people were treated because of their sexuality. Justin Fashanu was barred from training with his team when Brian Clough found out about his sexuality.

Fashanu came out publicly in 1990 and was abused by teammates and crowds alike. The world has changed a lot since then but it has taken the full 32 years for another professional footballer in England to come out publicly.

People like Nick are risking a lot coming out while still in the public eye. Hopefully we can get to a point where it’s a non-issue, but we aren’t even close to that right now.
"People like Nick are risking a lot coming out while still in the public eye" Are they really?
By the reaction of all his teamates, his employers, his fans on here there was no risk to worry at all.
One of his own teamates came out only recently and was applauded.
He got the same reaction the likes of Nigel Owens and Gareth Thomas got years ago.
It didn't stop Leo Varadkar getting elected in his constituency time and again and becoming the leader of this country.

The reality is that most people don't care.
You are making this a black and white conversation.
Sure, most people don’t care, but that is not the same as saying that nobody cares.
It also doesn’t mean that nobody that matters will care.

The truth is, whilst Ireland is very progressive, and you are correct, most people don’t care, there are still plenty of people who do.

A good friend of mine came out to his family about 6 years ago, his father’s first reply was to tell my friend to leave and don’t come back.

I know of one former Munster and Ireland player who pretended to be straight throughout their playing career, going as far as having plenty of girlfriends, and only recently came out.

Whilst Nick may now be feeling that he should have done this years ago, it was still a very brave move and was definitely not an easy thing to do.
“Everything is Legal until you are caught” does not mean that you are not breaking the laws, it simply means that players will play the ref, and will break the laws of the game if they believe they won’t, or until they do, get caught.
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LeRouxIsPHat
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by LeRouxIsPHat »

Saying that people don’t care completely ignores what was going through his head. It’s a huge deal to him personally and will be to many others as well, hopefully the overwhelmingly positive response will mean that soon others won’t have to struggle in private as well.

Jesus it’s hard enough for most people to open up to friends and family never mind make a public announcement and have to wait for the reaction.
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paddyor
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by paddyor »

It's pride month ffs. They chose to do it now because it's pride month and it might help someone like him in that situation. I hope anyone in the closet of any age who see's the reaction see's how positive the reaction is and that they can have that too. It's an unambiguosly good thing and if you feel the need to jump in with culture war brain and start waffling about virtue signalling you're probably too online(been there myself) and should just log off.
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England A 8 - 14 Ireland A, 25th Jan 2014
Ruddock(c) 19/2 Tackles
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Oldschoolsocks
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by Oldschoolsocks »

paddyor wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 11:49 pm It's pride month ffs. They chose to do it now because it's pride month and it might help someone like him in that situation. I hope anyone in the closet of any age who see's the reaction see's how positive the reaction is and that they can have that too. It's an unambiguosly good thing and if you feel the need to jump in with culture war brain and start waffling about virtue signalling you're probably too online(been there myself) and should just log off.
I could not have said this better myself
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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by The Doc »

deco wrote:
Oldschoolsocks wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 12:39 pm
LeinsterLeader wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 12:07 pm I suppose the hope is someday stuff like this won't be.
It shouldn’t have to be, but it is.

There's a big dollop of virtue signaling mixed in to be fair (the comments, not N McC).
The use of the phrase "virtue signalling" is always the biggest signal for me



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Re: Leinster Squad 21-22

Post by Hippo »

paddyor wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 11:49 pm It's pride month ffs. They chose to do it now because it's pride month and it might help someone like him in that situation. I hope anyone in the closet of any age who see's the reaction see's how positive the reaction is and that they can have that too. It's an unambiguosly good thing and if you feel the need to jump in with culture war brain and start waffling about virtue signalling you're probably too online(been there myself) and should just log off.
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