Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

[Dave Cahill]

There are three narratives to Munster as they enter into a new coaching era that will be looked at

1) Munster are a mediocre team who were lifted by a good coaching into a good finishing position considering their quality. A League Quarter final and a HECC quarter final loss on penos along with qualifying for next seasons HECC would be seen as a fine return by many fans of many teams in the URC, Prem and Top14

2) Munster a good team let down by mediocre coaching and with the team they have two quarter finals is a bit of a let down

3) Munster are an okay team and JVG is an okay coach who probably finished where they pretty much should have all things considered.

[ronk]

There are three narratives to Munster as they enter into a new coaching era that will be looked at

1) Munster are a mediocre team who were lifted by a good coaching into a good finishing position considering their quality. A League Quarter final and a HECC quarter final loss on penos along with qualifying for next seasons HECC would be seen as a fine return by many fans of many teams in the URC, Prem and Top14

2) Munster a good team let down by mediocre coaching and with the team they have two quarter finals is a bit of a let down

3) Munster are an okay team and JVG is an okay coach who probably finished where they pretty much should have all things considered.

Can I add a 4th. Leinster have better players because they've been better coached.

Van Graan was given resources to achieve more. The squad is now weaker than it could have been. If Rowntree gets it right, the team should obviously be more competitive. But we should also see that players start to look better in the Irish setup too and the pipeline of young players should look more promising.

The way Coombes and Daly hit a wall very soon after entering the Irish squad looks like they were badly prepared for the requirements of the international setup. Someone like Carbery who's been around longer and has wider experience to fall back on looked better in the Irish setup than Munster (still issues).

[munster#1]

Bit of injury update.
Hopefully Ahern’s injury is not a bad one, as he will be needed coming into next season.

https://www.munsterrugby.ie/2022/06/08/ ... pdate-203/

[Laighin Break]

Did Coombes hit a wall? I thought he was just unlucky with injuries

[hugonaut]

There are three narratives to Munster as they enter into a new coaching era that will be looked at

1) Munster are a mediocre team who were lifted by a good coaching into a good finishing position considering their quality. A League Quarter final and a HECC quarter final loss on penos along with qualifying for next seasons HECC would be seen as a fine return by many fans of many teams in the URC, Prem and Top14

2) Munster a good team let down by mediocre coaching and with the team they have two quarter finals is a bit of a let down

3) Munster are an okay team and JVG is an okay coach who probably finished where they pretty much should have all things considered.

Obvious but still thought-provoking options DC.

It is always interesting to see a new coach taking over one of the provinces. The way that the game is set up in Ireland means that the playing groups are more static in the provinces than they are in England or France. There are far fewer transfers of players. Given that scenario, comparisons between an out-going coach/coaching group and his/their successor/s have fewer variables to muddle evaluation.

[ronk]

So more like international rugby then, but faster because they have more time together.

[munster#1]

Just been informed by a source who is usually right, that Munster have been given the green light to sign and NIQ TH.

Supposedly they have been in talks with a French based prop.
Thinking logically it would likely be someone who comes recommended by Prendergast, I just can’t think who it might be.

[ChrisUppy]

Well they haven't helped their seeding for the Heineken Cup, fortunately that might not be an issue this year.

I think it's time for them to take URC more seriously. Get fans behind it and recognise that they won't get the HC success they crave without building on URC. All the more so with SA teams competing for the limited places.

If the Welsh and Scots bounce back they could be caught out and miss entirely. 18 games is a short season.

There's a fair bit of transformation needed but there are some good building blocks.

I really hope they choose now to stop that scrapping nonsense. It's worked for them but really it's an overused and mostly ineffective tactic.

Guys like Kendellen can actually play rugby. If they'd tried that they wouldn't have been chasing the game.

I've noticed with Kendellen that he seems determined to take up the mantel as chief collar grabber and it wasn't something I picked up from him in u20s. He was at it with Harry Byrne amongst others in Lansdowne and instigated it with Henderson last Friday - hopefully that one was a lesson to him. Focus on the rugby first and foremost Alex

[ChrisUppy]

Just been informed by a source who is usually right, that Munster have been given the green light to sign and NIQ TH.

Supposedly they have been in talks with a French based prop.
Thinking logically it would likely be someone who comes recommended by Prendergast, I just can’t think who it might be.

Cross posting M#1's personal Munster thread to here.

Would make a lot of sense, they've been crying out for a decent TH since Botha. I kind of thought Oli Jager was destined to be handed to them but he doesn't seem interested in coming back to play here and fair play he's making a decent career for himself out in NZ.

Presumably this would be a non French TH as they rarely leave. Just looking at Racing, Trevor Nyakane is on their books and would be exactly the profile of player they're looking for. 33, an international, can even play both sides of the scrum.

[Oldschoolsocks]

Well they do need a tight head, I just wonder if Salanoa had stayed put would he have progressed more?

There’s no way to know for sure but given the numbers of young forwards breaking through at a consistent rate you’d have to say the chances are at least more likely than not…

[munster#1]

Interestingly, I’m hearing that they are also in talks with an IQ player based on the UK.

I’d say the Toulouse game was a big eye opener on the requirement to strengthen that position.

[FLIP]

Well they do need a tight head, I just wonder if Salanoa had stayed put would he have progressed more?

There’s no way to know for sure but given the numbers of young forwards breaking through at a consistent rate you’d have to say the chances are at least more likely than not…

I mean, at this point you can insert any player who left Leinster for Munster into your statement about having progressed more.

[Oldschoolsocks]

Well they do need a tight head, I just wonder if Salanoa had stayed put would he have progressed more?

There’s no way to know for sure but given the numbers of young forwards breaking through at a consistent rate you’d have to say the chances are at least more likely than not…

I mean, at this point you can insert any player who left Leinster for Munster into your statement about having progressed more.

True that

[paddyor]

.

[paddyor]

Interestingly, I’m hearing that they are also in talks with an IQ player based on the UK.

I’d say the Toulouse game was a big eye opener on the requirement to strengthen that position.

Your man who played for Ireland at U20, capped by England 5 years ago? Bracken or Brookes?

[Barry]

Interestingly, I’m hearing that they are also in talks with an IQ player based on the UK.

I’d say the Toulouse game was a big eye opener on the requirement to strengthen that position.

Your man who played for Ireland at U20, capped by England 5 years ago? Bracken or Brookes?

They could try getting Jager back from Crusaders, although I wouldn't hold my breath on that happening.

Sent from my VOG-L09 using Tapatalk

[ronk]

Just been informed by a source who is usually right, that Munster have been given the green light to sign and NIQ TH.

Supposedly they have been in talks with a French based prop.
Thinking logically it would likely be someone who comes recommended by Prendergast, I just can’t think who it might be.

Cross posting M#1's personal Munster thread to here.

Would make a lot of sense, they've been crying out for a decent TH since Botha. I kind of thought Oli Jager was destined to be handed to them but he doesn't seem interested in coming back to play here and fair play he's making a decent career for himself out in NZ.

Presumably this would be a non French TH as they rarely leave. Just looking at Racing, Trevor Nyakane is on their books and would be exactly the profile of player they're looking for. 33, an international, can even play both sides of the scrum.

Makes no sense whatsoever that Munster be allowed chop Ryan and sign a NIQ. Sure, he's fallen out of the Ireland squad but he's still on the depth chart and could be needed with injuries. There are only 3 tightheads before you're switching someone across or recalling Moore. It's a year out from the World Cup.

It's making a call to give up on Knox and Salanoa without ever giving them a chance. The only justification is panic (or playing chicken) and it's a terrible terrible reason. A new coach gives the excuse that they can blame the outgoing guy but it's also showing that there's zero backbone over being serious about development. Tighthead was the red-line. BJ Botha was extended to 5 years and they had to develop a tighthead no matter what. They didn't and now they've giving up.

Knox got a 2 year extension, Salanoa 3.

Why would anything think that Munster will change if they allow this? May as well have kept JvG.

[Colmodon]

Interestingly, I’m hearing that they are also in talks with an IQ player based on the UK.

I’d say the Toulouse game was a big eye opener on the requirement to strengthen that position.

Are they bringing John Ryan back on loan so they can keep picking Archer and Ryan forever?

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Interestingly, I’m hearing that they are also in talks with an IQ player based on the UK.

I’d say the Toulouse game was a big eye opener on the requirement to strengthen that position.

Are they bringing John Ryan back on loan so they can keep picking Archer and Ryan forever?

[munster#1]

Interestingly, I’m hearing that they are also in talks with an IQ player based on the UK.

I’d say the Toulouse game was a big eye opener on the requirement to strengthen that position.

Are they bringing John Ryan back on loan so they can keep picking Archer and Ryan forever?

I wish that Ryan was staying. He really is imo an under rated player, who should have added to his caps tally.

Unfortunately, he has been offered a very lucrative contract, he has been told that he is not in Farrells plan's, and Munster were unable to persuade him to stay.

Imo Munster would be a much better team next season if they can lock in at least 1 top class TH, which will allow them to continue to develop locally at LH and Hooker.