Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

[leinsterforever]

The route to success at provincial level is to develop lots of Ireland internationals, because you need high quality players and there's very limited scope to sign international standard players if they're tied to other countries.

You'd have to wonder if Munster really buy into that. If their Ireland internationals aren't given central contracts they're hesitant to pay the increased wages of an international themselves.

[munster#1]

That’s the point. They weren’t given minutes, but just saying that does not mean that Munster are unwilling to develop players.

For me, on the outside looking in it looks like it is believed that they are either not ready or not able to play at the required level.

Looking at it and trying to apply logic, Salanoa has had a horrid time with injury, which would stunt anyones development, and given his late switch to the sport, he was already at a disadvantage.

Knox is still relatively young, and has also had his injury issues.
But even with that, he has 25 appearances to date, which is not great, but not bad either for an injury hampered 23 year old TH.
As a direct comparison, Abdaladze at 3 years Knox’s senior has only been given 17 appearances despite the fact that Leinster have a shallow depth pool when the internationals are away.


TH has always been a problem position in Ireland, with all 4 provinces continuously looking to make signings there.

Leinster don't have an issue at TH though, given they've produced the best Irish TH of the pro era and Porter, along with having a Samoan captain for league games. So that's a moot point.

Munster haven't handled their TH situation well, and have not given game time to the guys they will now need to be ready and able to play in their European 23.

Knox has 300 minutes this year. Next season he'll be one injury to a pretty mediocre 34 year old away from being starting TH in every game, to be backed by a guy who has never started a pro rugby game.

That's a major succession planning failure no matter how you look at it.

You are confirming what I have said, which is that each province has looked externally to fill he TH position for most of the pro era.
This time around Leinster have a Samoan (is he captain?) on their books along with a Georgian. This continues on from the numerous other signings in that position over the pro era.

Munster, Ulster and Connacht just like Leinster have looked externally to fill voids in the same position, so this is not a go at Leinster.

Where I fully agree with you is that, Munster have done well with Archer and Ryan for much of the last decade, but it is past time to look externally for an international quality TH, in the same manner that Leinster have.

[OTT]

Any Munster news this morning?

[Morf]

You are confirming what I have said, which is that each province has looked externally to fill he TH position for most of the pro era.
This time around Leinster have a Samoan (is he captain?) on their books along with a Georgian. This continues on from the numerous other signings in that position over the pro era.

Munster, Ulster and Connacht just like Leinster have looked externally to fill voids in the same position, so this is not a go at Leinster.

Where I fully agree with you is that, Munster have done well with Archer and Ryan for much of the last decade, but it is past time to look externally for an international quality TH, in the same manner that Leinster have.

You're thinking of his aul' lad.

[Colmodon]

That’s the point. They weren’t given minutes, but just saying that does not mean that Munster are unwilling to develop players.

For me, on the outside looking in it looks like it is believed that they are either not ready or not able to play at the required level.

Looking at it and trying to apply logic, Salanoa has had a horrid time with injury, which would stunt anyones development, and given his late switch to the sport, he was already at a disadvantage.

Knox is still relatively young, and has also had his injury issues.
But even with that, he has 25 appearances to date, which is not great, but not bad either for an injury hampered 23 year old TH.
As a direct comparison, Abdaladze at 3 years Knox’s senior has only been given 17 appearances despite the fact that Leinster have a shallow depth pool when the internationals are away.


TH has always been a problem position in Ireland, with all 4 provinces continuously looking to make signings there.

Leinster don't have an issue at TH though, given they've produced the best Irish TH of the pro era and Porter, along with having a Samoan captain for league games. So that's a moot point.

Munster haven't handled their TH situation well, and have not given game time to the guys they will now need to be ready and able to play in their European 23.

Knox has 300 minutes this year. Next season he'll be one injury to a pretty mediocre 34 year old away from being starting TH in every game, to be backed by a guy who has never started a pro rugby game.

That's a major succession planning failure no matter how you look at it.

You are confirming what I have said, which is that each province has looked externally to fill he TH position for most of the pro era.
This time around Leinster have a Samoan (is he captain?) on their books along with a Georgian. This continues on from the numerous other signings in that position over the pro era.

Munster, Ulster and Connacht just like Leinster have looked externally to fill voids in the same position, so this is not a go at Leinster.

Where I fully agree with you is that, Munster have done well with Archer and Ryan for much of the last decade, but it is past time to look externally for an international quality TH, in the same manner that Leinster have.

If you want to count a fella who's been in dublin since the age of 5 as a Georgian, then munster probably have their fill of external signings at tight head with Knox and Salanoa.

[munster#1]

Leinster don't have an issue at TH though, given they've produced the best Irish TH of the pro era and Porter, along with having a Samoan captain for league games. So that's a moot point.

Munster haven't handled their TH situation well, and have not given game time to the guys they will now need to be ready and able to play in their European 23.

Knox has 300 minutes this year. Next season he'll be one injury to a pretty mediocre 34 year old away from being starting TH in every game, to be backed by a guy who has never started a pro rugby game.

That's a major succession planning failure no matter how you look at it.

You are confirming what I have said, which is that each province has looked externally to fill he TH position for most of the pro era.
This time around Leinster have a Samoan (is he captain?) on their books along with a Georgian. This continues on from the numerous other signings in that position over the pro era.

Munster, Ulster and Connacht just like Leinster have looked externally to fill voids in the same position, so this is not a go at Leinster.

Where I fully agree with you is that, Munster have done well with Archer and Ryan for much of the last decade, but it is past time to look externally for an international quality TH, in the same manner that Leinster have.

If you want to count a fella who's been in dublin since the age of 5 as a Georgian, then munster probably have their fill of external signings at tight head with Knox and Salanoa.

Sorry hadn’t realised he was here so long, I think I had him confused with Salanoa as the player that was brought into the academy from abroad.

In Munster’s case I would see both Knox and Salanoa as external signings as Knox was brought into the academy straight from SA, and Salanoa from the US via Leinster.

[FLIP]

Can we get the other thread merged into this one? This thread was first

[munster#1]

Renamed thread so it is not confused with the many other Munster Threads.

[munster#1]

Great job opportunity for anyone looking to get into a professional rugby setup.

https://www.munsterrugby.ie/2022/06/09/ ... tionist-2/

[riocard911]

Can we get the other thread merged into this one? This thread was first

Yes, please. The General Rugby page is suffering from Munster thread inflation....

[betty swallocks]

Can we get the other thread merged into this one? This thread was first

Yes, please. The General Rugby page is suffering from Munster thread inflation....

Quite Riocard. Too much bloody coverage for the 4th best team in the country. Merge.

[munster#1]

Inpho Following the conclusion of the 2021/22 season, Munster Rugby can confirm the full list of players who will depart the province this month.
It was announced earlier this year that Chris Cloete, Damian de Allende, Jake Flannery, Matt Gallagher, Jason Jenkins, Declan Moore, Kevin O’Byrne and John Ryan will move on.

In addition to the eight players above, the province can confirm that Seán French, Alex McHenry, Rowan Osborne and Academy player Jonathan Wren have all completed their time at Munster.

Seán French and Alex McHenry will both depart for playing opportunities in England.

Rowan Osborne is to retire from professional rugby on medical grounds due to a concussion sustained earlier in the season.

Rowan has received specialist medical care since the concussion, and despite his best efforts and those of the medical team, along with lengthy discussions with those close to him, the decision to retire was made in the best interests of his long-term health.

Unfortunately for Academy back three player Jonathan Wren, the Ireland U20s Grand Slam winner is also retiring from the game on medical grounds despite battling back from a number of setbacks.

[wixfjord]

That’s the point. They weren’t given minutes, but just saying that does not mean that Munster are unwilling to develop players.

For me, on the outside looking in it looks like it is believed that they are either not ready or not able to play at the required level.

Looking at it and trying to apply logic, Salanoa has had a horrid time with injury, which would stunt anyones development, and given his late switch to the sport, he was already at a disadvantage.

Knox is still relatively young, and has also had his injury issues.
But even with that, he has 25 appearances to date, which is not great, but not bad either for an injury hampered 23 year old TH.
As a direct comparison, Abdaladze at 3 years Knox’s senior has only been given 17 appearances despite the fact that Leinster have a shallow depth pool when the internationals are away.


TH has always been a problem position in Ireland, with all 4 provinces continuously looking to make signings there.

Leinster don't have an issue at TH though, given they've produced the best Irish TH of the pro era and Porter, along with having a Samoan captain for league games. So that's a moot point.

Munster haven't handled their TH situation well, and have not given game time to the guys they will now need to be ready and able to play in their European 23.

Knox has 300 minutes this year. Next season he'll be one injury to a pretty mediocre 34 year old away from being starting TH in every game, to be backed by a guy who has never started a pro rugby game.

That's a major succession planning failure no matter how you look at it.

You are confirming what I have said, which is that each province has looked externally to fill he TH position for most of the pro era.
This time around Leinster have a Samoan (is he captain?) on their books along with a Georgian. This continues on from the numerous other signings in that position over the pro era.

Munster, Ulster and Connacht just like Leinster have looked externally to fill voids in the same position, so this is not a go at Leinster.

Where I fully agree with you is that, Munster have done well with Archer and Ryan for much of the last decade, but it is past time to look externally for an international quality TH, in the same manner that Leinster have.

Vakh is Irish. Of course you're trolling with that reference so that's another moot point.

Have Munster 'done well with Archer and Ryan for much of the last decade'? Isn't that the whole point? Both are fairly middle of the road THs and the better, younger one is leaving.

Munster have failed to plan for the future by failing to successfully bring through any of the young THs on their books and give them any meaningful gametime.

[munster#1]

That’s a substantial number of departing players, and will go a long way to addressing the large squad as discussed earlier.

Sad to see Wren and Osborne having their careers cut short.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

You are confirming what I have said, which is that each province has looked externally to fill he TH position for most of the pro era.
This time around Leinster have a Samoan (is he captain?) on their books along with a Georgian. This continues on from the numerous other signings in that position over the pro era.

Munster, Ulster and Connacht just like Leinster have looked externally to fill voids in the same position, so this is not a go at Leinster.

Where I fully agree with you is that, Munster have done well with Archer and Ryan for much of the last decade, but it is past time to look externally for an international quality TH, in the same manner that Leinster have.

You're thinking of his aul' lad.

You’re thinking he’s a genuine poster. He’s quite clearly being a full time WUM now, stuff like that is obviously bait.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

I didn’t expect Wren to get his career going at this stage but he did look really good for the 20’s, real shame for him not to make it.

Hadn’t heard that about Osborne, hope he’s okay. Strange for a scrumhalf to have concussion issues.

[blockhead]

Can we get the other thread merged into this one? This thread was first

Yes, please. The General Rugby page is suffering from Munster thread inflation....

Quite Riocard. Too much bloody coverage for the 4th best team in the country. Merge.

You reckon they're better than Clontarf?

[Oldschoolsocks]

Any Munster news this morning?

Rowan Osborne retiring due to concussion related injury.

He’s only 25, here’s hoping he has no longer term difficulties…

https://www.munsterrugby.ie/2022/06/10/ ... confirmed/

[munster#1]

You are confirming what I have said, which is that each province has looked externally to fill he TH position for most of the pro era.
This time around Leinster have a Samoan (is he captain?) on their books along with a Georgian. This continues on from the numerous other signings in that position over the pro era.

Munster, Ulster and Connacht just like Leinster have looked externally to fill voids in the same position, so this is not a go at Leinster.

Where I fully agree with you is that, Munster have done well with Archer and Ryan for much of the last decade, but it is past time to look externally for an international quality TH, in the same manner that Leinster have.

You're thinking of his aul' lad.

You’re thinking he’s a genuine poster. He’s quite clearly being a full time WUM now, stuff like that is obviously bait.

Ah will you come off it.

It was clearly an error and one that I have admitted to.
Who in their right mind would go on to a forum to be a WUM?
I can assure you that I am not a child.

[OTT]

That’s sad to hear. It was a great story when he came in to Leinster off the back of his Trinity performances, I remember hearing Leo talking about it at the time. Best of luck to him for the future.