Munster Rugby - Semi Conscious, the Series Finale??? - 2020/21

[Keith]

Big game for Munster tonight, not a given in any way, but I expect that Munster team to have enough to shade a victory.

Excited to see Conway back, if he can regain last seasons form then he won’t be far from the Irish match day squad.

Hoping for a big game from Casey

Good first half for Munster. Casey is playing well again and Cloete has been a handful at the breakdowns.

[Morf]

The stats item get thrown a round a bit alright, but stats only give a part of a picture.
If a players role is to be the second man at every breakdown, then they will have a low tackle count and will likely be stuck at the bottom of a ruck for large portions of the game, meaning they will also have a low carry count.

What those 2 stats don’t show is that the second man into a ruck has assisted in providing clean and fast ball for the SH.

It is funny how people use stats to form an argument, when anti Heaslip fans would use his poor stats against him, stats were evil to Heaslip fans, and don’t paint the full picture.
It would appear that those same Heaslip fans are now happy to use stats again, but in defence of their argument that POM is useless.

To say that POM has benefited from every possible manner from coaches, pundits and journalists is a bit odd.
You are essentially stating that these experienced, respected and well paid rugby professionals are all wrong, but how could so many so called experts all be wrong?

Well they do put a metric on measurable actions.

Murray Kinsella/Demented Mole have done articles noting and giving value to being present at rucks and being positively active at rucks I think. These stats aren't terribly hard to find if looked for either.

Heaslip's detractors seemed to only care about carry metres from memory which wouldn't flatter many Irish 8s in recent times.

I'm not saying they're wrong. I was more partly indicating my own ignorance/lack of judgement but stats aren't necessarily the thing that illustrates it. It's things that seem less tangible. If POM's stats were great it'd be obvious how I was wrong.

[munster#1]

Happy to take the win last night, but it feels like a BP that got away.

The Munster scrum was again very strong, as was the lineout despite the conditions.

Casey put real zip on the ball, and was very good for his try, and was so close to getting a second.
IMO he is the future for Ireland, and should see minutes against Italy.

Chris Farrell had a very good game, and should also be considered for action against Italy.

The most enjoyable element of the team was the Munster backrow, as a unit that was the most balanced combination we have seen for a good while.
It is amazing to have players of their abilities available during the 6 nations.
JOD once again had an amazing game, put in some hard graft, and took his try very well.
Cloete was a menace at the breakdown, and is a real groundhog 7.
But the real standout was Coombes. His energy, strength and skill put him as one of the best in the country IMO.
I still can’t understand how he was released from the Irish squad prior to the French game.

[leinsterforever]

Haven't seen the game but is it Coombes's mobility and consequent open field tackling they're worried about? He did miss one against Clermont. Sending him away from the squad looks strange just looking in from the outside.

[Fan with smartphone]

Happy to take the win last night, but it feels like a BP that got away.

The Munster scrum was again very strong, as was the lineout despite the conditions.

Casey put real zip on the ball, and was very good for his try, and was so close to getting a second.
IMO he is the future for Ireland, and should see minutes against Italy.

Chris Farrell had a very good game, and should also be considered for action against Italy.

The most enjoyable element of the team was the Munster backrow, as a unit that was the most balanced combination we have seen for a good while.
It is amazing to have players of their abilities available during the 6 nations.
JOD once again had an amazing game, put in some hard graft, and took his try very well.
Cloete was a menace at the breakdown, and is a real groundhog 7.
But the real standout was Coombes. His energy, strength and skill put him as one of the best in the country IMO.
I still can’t understand how he was released from the Irish squad prior to the French game.

O’Donoghue seemed to cause an awful disruption on line out ball too. That’s the best I’ve seen him in a while. Great to see as he has a high ceiling and is just a likeable player. Casey was very clever to win that free kick at the scrum and looked really sharp with all the body language stuff. His actual play...he got snaffled a few times, but there’s no doubt he is a livewire and I enjoy watching him play too.

I though Hanrahan outplayed his opposite number too. When Munster do go to move it he looked impressive and generally he does his part of the deal. Also thought Munster moved well towards the end when they were going for the bonus point with the pressure off. That was all their players looking to play and had Healy at 10.

[munster#1]

Haven't seen the game but is it Coombes's mobility and consequent open field tackling they're worried about? He did miss one against Clermont. Sending him away from the squad looks strange just looking in from the outside.

I hadn’t heard any reason for his release, so that is interesting, especially as I would imagine mobility would not be an issue for Coombes who regularly makes high number of carries, metres and tackles.

If this is true, then at least he has been given a clear work on, even if I am in disagreement with this assertion.

Have you a link to a source for this?

[leinsterforever]

No, just speculating.

[munster#1]

No, just speculating.

No bother. I was thinking that it was a bit odd given that defence and mobility would appear to be among his strengths.

Fairly sure he had the most tackles and carries last night, and must be one of the top for meters carried too.

[munster#1]

Joey is set to make his long awaited return to the rugby pitch.

What a great piece of news to hear.
I do not expect him to be anywhere near international standard right away, but given a few games and a lot of full on training, it would be great to have him back and ready to go at the start of next season.

15. Mike Haley
14. Calvin Nash
13. Rory Scannell
12. Damian de Allende
11. Shane Daly
10. JJ Hanrahan
9. Nick McCarthy

1. James Cronin
2. Kevin O’Byrne
3. John Ryan
4. Jean Kleyn
5. Fineen Wycherley
6. Jack O’Donoghue (captain)
7. Chris Cloete
8. Jack O’Sullivan

[The Doc]

I do not expect him to be anywhere near international standard right away, but given a few games and a lot of full on training, it would be great to have him back and ready to go at the start of next season.

I'd say if he can get through 20 mins without any issues it would be a win. Performance is pretty much irrelevant at this stage really

[hugonaut]

I'd say if he can get through 20 mins without any issues it would be a win. Performance is pretty much irrelevant at this stage really

I agree. He has been out of rugby for so long that there will probably be some rustiness. I'm very happy to see him get back on the pitch. It has taken an awful long time and any time an injury extends that far you begin to fear the worst.

[Oldschool]

I'd say if he can get through 20 mins without any issues it would be a win. Performance is pretty much irrelevant at this stage really

I agree. He has been out of rugby for so long that there will probably be some rustiness. I'm very happy to see him get back on the pitch. It has taken an awful long time and any time an injury extends that far you begin to fear the worst.

+1

[munster#1]

Billy Holland announced his retirement.

Such a shame to see a man with his experience leaving the game, especially when he still has a lot to offer.
He will not be the last player to be forced into retirement due to Covid, but for me he will probably be one of the most influential.

[wixfjord]

Billy Holland announced his retirement.

Such a shame to see a man with his experience leaving the game, especially when he still has a lot to offer.
He will not be the last player to be forced into retirement due to Covid, but for me he will probably be one of the most influential.

'Forced into retirement'?

His announcement yesterday said literally the opposite:

“I have always been determined to finish my career whilst still playing well and adding value to the jersey each time I get to put it on.

To be in a position to call time on such a fantastic experience, on my own terms, is one I am extremely grateful for. I believe the time is right for me, my family and for Munster Rugby to hang up my boots."

[OTT]

Nothing much not to like about Billy Holland. Great professional, loved by coaches he played for, loved by players he played with and loved by fans of the team he played for and respected by the opposition fans.

I remember being chuffed he got his Irish cap even though he was 30ish and knowing he would not have been someone who was going to be a regular going forward. not a wasted cap, a cap that everyone (well anyone who isn't a complete ballix) could see the upside in.

Guys like Holland are massive for teams, we have one ourselves in Molony, they put it in every week and are a bit of consistency in an environment that changes more than coaches would like. Always ready to go to war and fight for the badge.

Well done on a great career Billy, a losing league medal to wrap it up with now

[Oldschool]

Nothing much not to like about Billy Holland. Great professional, loved by coaches he played for, loved by players he played with and loved by fans of the team he played for and respected by the opposition fans.

I remember being chuffed he got his Irish cap even though he was 30ish and knowing he would not have been someone who was going to be a regular going forward. not a wasted cap, a cap that everyone (well anyone who isn't a complete ballix) could see the upside in.

Guys like Holland are massive for teams, we have one ourselves in Molony, they put it in every week and are a bit of consistency in an environment that changes more than coaches would like. Always ready to go to war and fight for the badge.

Well done on a great career Billy, a losing league medal to wrap it up with now

A real club legend, Mr Dependable for Munster.

[Ruckedtobits]

Nothing much not to like about Billy Holland. Great professional, loved by coaches he played for, loved by players he played with and loved by fans of the team he played for and respected by the opposition fans.

I remember being chuffed he got his Irish cap even though he was 30ish and knowing he would not have been someone who was going to be a regular going forward. not a wasted cap, a cap that everyone (well anyone who isn't a complete ballix) could see the upside in.

Guys like Holland are massive for teams, we have one ourselves in Molony, they put it in every week and are a bit of consistency in an environment that changes more than coaches would like. Always ready to go to war and fight for the badge.

Well done on a great career Billy, §μ¿¡Г₹¥￦₪:-$ θΩ฿ريال $€! etc.

+1
But I'd prefer to sent Billy off wondering do Leinster fans really appreciate him!

[blockhead]

Nothing much not to like about Billy Holland. Great professional, loved by coaches he played for, loved by players he played with and loved by fans of the team he played for and respected by the opposition fans.

I remember being chuffed he got his Irish cap even though he was 30ish and knowing he would not have been someone who was going to be a regular going forward. not a wasted cap, a cap that everyone (well anyone who isn't a complete ballix) could see the upside in.

Guys like Holland are massive for teams, we have one ourselves in Molony, they put it in every week and are a bit of consistency in an environment that changes more than coaches would like. Always ready to go to war and fight for the badge.

Well done on a great career Billy, a losing league medal to wrap it up with now

It's funny, I was going to compare him to Ross Moloney too. These lads are the glue that holds the provinces together. They might get a cap, they might not be picked for their province if eveyone is fit for the big game in Europe but they keep coming back and giving it their all. Every Province has and needs these guys.
Great professional.

[ronk]

Nothing much not to like about Billy Holland. Great professional, loved by coaches he played for, loved by players he played with and loved by fans of the team he played for and respected by the opposition fans.

I remember being chuffed he got his Irish cap even though he was 30ish and knowing he would not have been someone who was going to be a regular going forward. not a wasted cap, a cap that everyone (well anyone who isn't a complete ballix) could see the upside in.

Guys like Holland are massive for teams, we have one ourselves in Molony, they put it in every week and are a bit of consistency in an environment that changes more than coaches would like. Always ready to go to war and fight for the badge.

Well done on a great career Billy, a losing league medal to wrap it up with now

It's funny, I was going to compare him to Ross Moloney too. These lads are the glue that holds the provinces together. They might get a cap, they might not be picked for their province if eveyone is fit for the big game in Europe but they keep coming back and giving it their all. Every Province has and needs these guys.
Great professional.

I have a lot of time for Holland and he’s turned out a good career after a very slow start. He stuck it out when the odds were against him and he’s a rare fairytale of a late bloomer. He clung on at the bottom of the depth chart for a long time and probably only managed that with a bit of name recognition, but he proved himself. It’s heart warming.

I don’t agree with the comparison with Molony. Molony is 26 and has over 100 caps, he’s captained Leinster multiple times and has long been a key player. He’s played Heineken Cup in 6 different seasons already.

At 26, it was a big thing for Holland getting 2 mins in 1 Heineken Cup game and he captained Munster A in the B&I Cup against Cross Keys.

In 15/16 Molony was 21 and getting over 20 games a season, it seemed like greater things weren’t far away but at least he’s still improving. He’s the sort of lock who’d normally be a late bloomer anyway.

[munster#1]

Great to see that big Pete has signed a 2 year contract.
Hopefully in the next few days we see some more Munster players nailed down.