Keith wrote: ↑May 3rd, 2023, 6:39 pm
Flash Gordon wrote: ↑May 3rd, 2023, 3:53 pm
IanD wrote: ↑May 2nd, 2023, 5:22 pm
I know you have an affiliation to London Irish and it is a drum you have been banging for a long time but seriously why would the IRFU take over an non entity of a organisation with no real link back to any of the myriad of clubs it emerged from who have no home ground and are £30 million in debt?
That's a lot of rugby balls for kids back home.
There's no way the IRFU would take on that debt for sure but the club is on the verge of bankruptcy. Either build a new Exiles franchise (ideally on the amateur club) or buy the insolvent professional club at virtually nothing and Strip the assets - there's no ground but their training facilities are exceptionally good (hench the productivity of the academy) you could also drive the link back to the amateur club and the Irish community. The advantages from an IRFU perspective are:
1. Recruit diaspora/Irish qualified players (there is already an Exiles organisation)
2. The expansion to a MUCH bigger market in London that the entirity of Ireland - run it like Exeter and turn a profit
3. Development opportunity for blocked players in the Irish system or players who need game time development or access to specific coaching/development
4. Development opportunity for academy players
5. Career option for players who want to play abroad but know they will lose Ireland options if they go - players who've gone to Irish or other English or French clubs are not always has beens or never weres...
6. Irish players get to play in a league with a different style and culture form which we benefit and learn
7. Development opportunity for Irish coaches
Irish have had 300 internationals on their books over the years, their Academy is incredibly productive and there's a long club history in a big rugby market. Now I would be very doubtful, this has been mooted for years, Keith Wood was a big advocate and nothing ever happened and I'm not sure the RFU would sanction but I'm also not sure it's worthy of being deemed an opportunity without benefits.
1. We already do that through the exile programme (as you've stated) and the best IQ players abroad are already snapped up by the provinces.
2. That market doesn't look all that big looking at LI's attendances. I can't think of any club running at a profit whereby they don't need a sugar daddy and/or union help. Are Exeter as well run as we think? Looking at their outgoing players for next season, it looks like they are making some of the biggest cutbacks in the prem.
3. Again who are these blocked players? The other three provinces are crying out for quality IQ players, hence why our players are linked with moves to them every year. Our players want to stay and fight for their place.
4. More centers of excellence around the country would be far more beneficial imo. I don't like the idea of pouring money into an academy where a lot of the players could also go on to play for England and others.
5. Taking away depth from the four provinces, for little to no gain.
6. Is that really that important in this day and age?
7. Yeah, fair.
Agree 100% on the investment points you make - more centres of excellence makes sense as does investing coaching talent into the academies in the provinces, particularly those not producing as much as us.
I do think there are pros to this possibility beyond the black and white merchants shouting on twitter (not you I hasten to add!).
To be clear I'm not suggesting subsidizing the club or spending millions rather that it would be a going concern, there should be no subsidy for the Academy but the idea of players coming through and having access to one of the best academies in England could be part of the overall concept. Crowds are a minority income owner for many professional sports which is why soccer saw very little income drop. For many premier league clubs it's 5-10% of turnover only. Sponsorship opportunities for the clubs with reach in England is step change stuff and the marketability of a European/South African League is significant. A URC franchise in London has considerably more economic possibility than most URC teams in the league and way more than some of the expansion opportunities they are looking at in the USA.
On players, there is still a diaspora out there in the UK and it's been the thing that's kept our soccer team going for the last 3 decades - by the way, not relevant, but found out last weekend that Gregory Aldritt was Irish qualified! The Exiles have produced stacks of Irish internationals and in recent times Dan Tuohy, Declan Fitzpatrick and Mike McCarthy became full internationals more recently still Keiron Marmion, Rhys Ruddock, Kieran Treadwell and Sammy Arnold. At the moment it's a tiny organisation compared to any of our professional outlets. We're only scratching the tip of the ice berg on that possibility.
On the depth point, from an IRFU perspective Sean O'Brien, Paddy Jackson (!!), Ian Madigan, Ultan Dillane, Sean O'Brien (the back), Rory O'Loughlin, James Cronin, Jack Dunne, John Ryan, Marty Moore, Ian Whitten, Quinn Roux just off the top of my head have gone to play abroad. These guys aren't duds. Coaching wise, Declan Kidney, Les Kiss, Jerry Flannery, Geordan Murphy, Mark McCall, Gareth Steenson (the last 3 after playing there) all went over. Similarly we all know the Leinster players who've gone to other provinces because they were blocked at Leinster. Now those players have stayed in the Irish system which is good of course. However, one of the reasons they have is because other provinces haven't run successful academies which needs to be fixed and hopefully that will. Frankly, if the IRFU are investing in international output, Connacht are a poor investment (don't take this as "get rid of Connacht", it absolutely isn't!).
Ultimately, there was an historical and highly productive relationship between the Exiles and the IRFU. I suspect the Exiles might be the biggest single source of players from club rugby in Ireland's history but the IRFU jettisoned them.
Again, I don't think it's going to happen, the RFU have the final say in their own country as they run rugby and I think they would block it and the reason they'd block it is because they'd probably take it as a fairly serious threat, which probably tells us something.