Munster 2013/2014

[paddyor]

Think Wallace is being unfair to Penney. The current pack is currently no where near as fiersome as the one Kidney left behind for Ireland. No amount of "values" could paper over the reality that Penney started from a much lower base(as did McGahan - more a declining base). Too many new/young players and scattered across 2 training camps too. The Munster team of the mid 00s had a core that had been together for years.

Leaving aside the soundbites about dog and values I think Foley is potentially a good coach and I'll withold judgement lest I become the new George Hook. He did a great job in taking apart the Saracens lineout in the 2012/13 HEC group stages(he may not be fully deserving of the credit but he was in charge of the forwards AFAIK). You'd hope the lesson of the second leg of the double header wasn't lost on him(failing to score or make in roads against 14 man Sarries).

Penney brought the group he had forward and Wallaces comments seem like an attempt to pretend that never happened. I really can't see where the lost time/opportunity is/was. Defeated semi-finalists was about the level of that Munster team!

[ronk]

The game and the laws of the game changed too. That Munster pack was type-formed to playing a particular game. They would have struggled anyway under Kidney in 2012 even if age/retirements hadn't kicked in.

Now with the swing back they'd be making hay with certain aspects, but they weren't built for this either. Their front row wouldn't survive at this level, their locks would be under power but still good. Back row is weaker now and those guys would have had no trouble adapting to the current game.

[ceemec]

James Coughlan released by mutual consent.

[johng]

James Coughlan released by mutual consent.

I heard Manix in might take him to Pau

[ronk]

Wow. Nice of them to release him. Guess they're happy with his signings. Big deal in France maybe.

[munster#1]

Can't blame caughlan at all, he has been a great servant and easily the most consistent player in the country.

He will be missed, by all munster fans for his attitude both off and on the pitch.

[blockhead]

I heard it said that he was also the most "unsung" player in the country.

[ceemec]

He's a loss, undoubtedly but this is the right time for both parties. Foley is no mug when it comes to No. 8s and he has been watching Coughlan this season. He has put in a number a really good performances but he's not anywhere near as consistently good as he once was. Even on MF, the last bastion of impartiality, he was rated way, way down the list in terms of being the best performer this year on their player ratings for the season.

He's right to go now and earn a little money but there's a good reason the rumoured destination is a lower division club.

Next season will see Copeland and Stander battling it out for the jersey. If they can grow into the role and gel with their flankers, the Munster back row can be stronger again by this time next year.

[simonokeeffe]

theyve got Copeland, Stander and Butler who is no mug
Cawlin knows he wont get into the Irish team so a 2 year deal in France say would be a good/well deserved way to cash out

[offshorerules]

High hopes for copeland and stander seems to improving but not convinced his best position is 8. For me the jury is out on butler as at times I thought he looked a bit lightweight but in truth I've only seen him 5 or 6 times so I'm open to correction.

Good luck to Coughlan though aside from Pom he's been Munsters best back row for a while now.

[ronk]

Don't know to what extent he fancies his chances under Foley.

[munster#1]

I know it is unlikely but I hope he gets snapped up by a top 14 team or even London Irish on a 3 year contract. he is far too good a player to settle for D2

[paddyor]

Connacht?

[blockhead]

I know it is unlikely but I hope he gets snapped up by a top 14 team or even London Irish on a 3 year contract. he is far too good a player to settle for D2

Sounds like he has a deal already set up.

[munster#1]

I know it is unlikely but I hope he gets snapped up by a top 14 team or even London Irish on a 3 year contract. he is far too good a player to settle for D2

Sounds like he has a deal already set up.

I know, and financially it is probably a massive boost as he'll probably get a 2 yr contract worth the equivalent of a 3yr here. Whereas if he were to stay, he has no guarantee past his current contract, and Is likely to just get a one year deal.

I just believe that he is better than D2, but unfortunately I don't make these decisions.

[ronk]

He's leaving when he's first choice for a team with ambitions to win the HC. I know he came late to pro rugby so he's not as well setup for the long term. Still a rare enough thing.

Good luck to him.

[Oldschool]

James Coughlan released by mutual consent.

I heard Manix in might take him to Pau

Maybe EOS' first signing?

[Oldschool]

I heard it said that he was also the most "unsung" player in the country.

Was that not Varley?

[fourthirtythree]

I heard it said that he was also the most "unsung" player in the country.

Was that not Varley?

No Varley was the most underrated by the locals down South, fine player, the anointed among the supporters was someone else so people conspired not to notice. Callin' was always going to go: they've signed two young, high profile, players in his position. Management obviously never rated him as highly as fans did.

[simonokeeffe]

IT reporting it is Pau