Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

[Keith]

Aye. Outside of Nash and maybe Casey when he came on its hard to see too many positives. Coombes very poor even though he hot a try. Carbery was brutal. A player that just looks lost. Kilcoyne was getting destroyed by Fagerson. Guys you’d expect to stand up teally let them down.

It's an absolute travesty what's happened to Carberry. I don't know how much of it is down to the injuries he's suffered or if its down to the way he's been managed. Either way it looks like he'll have to get out of Munster and start again somewhere. It's not working.

[riocard911]

The pass by Carbery to Coombes - which the latter knocked on - off the restart in Munster's 22, after they'd just managed to score two tries and put 14 points on the board in five minutes was absolute brain dead and totally snuffed out the "come back", as Glasgow got a scrum peno and a try out of it. On tonight's performance, Crowley has to start in Durban with Healy on the bench and with Murray and Casey sharing the scrum-half position. I know their forwards weren't winning the collisions, but Carbery and Patterson were dire.

[riocard911]

Aye. Outside of Nash and maybe Casey when he came on its hard to see too many positives. Coombes very poor even though he hot a try. Carbery was brutal. A player that just looks lost. Kilcoyne was getting destroyed by Fagerson. Guys you’d expect to stand up teally let them down.

Casey was headless when he came on. Typical performance from him, some good stuff but a lot of taking too much on himself and making small errors.

Taking a quick tap and getting turned over, two poor knock ons and a mental kick away when Munster were in the ascendency.

100%. And his continuously looking for aggro and kicking off argy-bargy at the slightest opportunity is painful to watch and counterproductive, IMO.

[Avenger]

Casey was far from perfect but he brought tempo which was completely lacking before. The knock on was bad alright.

[blockhead]

Glasgow looked really good in attack especially in the first half. They are back as a contender in the URC. I reckon they were missing about 7 front liners from the 6N squad, Munster were missing POM and Murray. Shocking performance from them. Good saturday evening entertainment though.
Coombes, Kleyn, Carbery, Hodnett, Crowley, Haley, Kilkoyne all missing out for 6N places becuase "they're not from Leinster"
Maybe Faz n co know what they're doing.

[elephantman]

Aye. Outside of Nash and maybe Casey when he came on its hard to see too many positives. Coombes very poor even though he hot a try. Carbery was brutal. A player that just looks lost. Kilcoyne was getting destroyed by Fagerson. Guys you’d expect to stand up teally let them down.

It's an absolute travesty what's happened to Carberry. I don't know how much of it is down to the injuries he's suffered or if its down to the way he's been managed. Either way it looks like he'll have to get out of Munster and start again somewhere. It's not working.

I think you’re right. I get the feeling that Rowntree isn’t his biggest fan either. Wouldn’t be a shock to see Crowley start at 10 next weekend.

It’s desperately sad to see Carbery playing so poorly. I’m biased of course but I’ve always thought his 2018 move to Munster was the wrong decision. He should have stayed at Leinster.

[enby]

They will never have any success with what they have in the front 5, Beirne excepted. They really need quality throughout that area. The ordinary Kleyn is the best of the current substandard bunch and that says it all.

Crawley is a 10 and a good 10 at that. They have to go with him over Joey. Haley is not good enough. Murray's experience will be needed in the short term but Casey is not the long term answer at 9.

They have made good progress this season but they have a long long way to go. Still well behind Ulster and on a par with Connacht

[jezzer]

Aye. Outside of Nash and maybe Casey when he came on its hard to see too many positives. Coombes very poor even though he hot a try. Carbery was brutal. A player that just looks lost. Kilcoyne was getting destroyed by Fagerson. Guys you’d expect to stand up teally let them down.

It's an absolute travesty what's happened to Carberry. I don't know how much of it is down to the injuries he's suffered or if its down to the way he's been managed. Either way it looks like he'll have to get out of Munster and start again somewhere. It's not working.

I think you’re right. I get the feeling that Rowntree isn’t his biggest fan either. Wouldn’t be a shock to see Crowley start at 10 next weekend.

It’s desperately sad to see Carbery playing so poorly. I’m biased of course but I’ve always thought his 2018 move to Munster was the wrong decision. He should have stayed at Leinster.

It's all Munsters fault that Carbery is playing poorly. Sure.

Joey was not good and that's on Joey. Not many Irish players have had the time money , patience and opportunities invested into them like he has. At some point it's on you to be the player people thought you could be or just get out of the way.

[wixfjord]

Aye. Outside of Nash and maybe Casey when he came on its hard to see too many positives. Coombes very poor even though he hot a try. Carbery was brutal. A player that just looks lost. Kilcoyne was getting destroyed by Fagerson. Guys you’d expect to stand up teally let them down.

It's an absolute travesty what's happened to Carberry. I don't know how much of it is down to the injuries he's suffered or if its down to the way he's been managed. Either way it looks like he'll have to get out of Munster and start again somewhere. It's not working.

It really is sad to see at this stage. At 27 it looks like his career could peter out without a bit of luck. Crowley is clearly a better 10 I think.

I wonder would Joey fancy a move back to blue to play 15 and challenge Hugo.

[wixfjord]

It's an absolute travesty what's happened to Carberry. I don't know how much of it is down to the injuries he's suffered or if its down to the way he's been managed. Either way it looks like he'll have to get out of Munster and start again somewhere. It's not working.

I think you’re right. I get the feeling that Rowntree isn’t his biggest fan either. Wouldn’t be a shock to see Crowley start at 10 next weekend.

It’s desperately sad to see Carbery playing so poorly. I’m biased of course but I’ve always thought his 2018 move to Munster was the wrong decision. He should have stayed at Leinster.

It's all Munsters fault that Carbery is playing poorly. Sure.

Joey was not good and that's on Joey. Not many Irish players have had the time money , patience and opportunities invested into them like he has. At some point it's on you to be the player people thought you could be or just get out of the way.

Don't think the original post was saying it's all Munster's fault at all.

But 100% he would be a better player had he stayed at Leinster. That's beyond doubt.

[Avenger]

At some point it's on you to be the player people thought you could be or just get out of the way.

Thats fair enough.
Its just a bit sad to see him fail so miserably.

I don’t like seeing players move to get ahead of someone he can’t get ahead of when he’s in the same environment. Shows a lack of fight in my opinion (albeit not very well informed on high level sporting environments).

[Keith]

Aye. Outside of Nash and maybe Casey when he came on its hard to see too many positives. Coombes very poor even though he hot a try. Carbery was brutal. A player that just looks lost. Kilcoyne was getting destroyed by Fagerson. Guys you’d expect to stand up teally let them down.

It's an absolute travesty what's happened to Carberry. I don't know how much of it is down to the injuries he's suffered or if its down to the way he's been managed. Either way it looks like he'll have to get out of Munster and start again somewhere. It's not working.

It really is sad to see at this stage. At 27 it looks like his career could peter out without a bit of luck. Crowley is clearly a better 10 I think.

I wonder would Joey fancy a move back to blue to play 15 and challenge Hugo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPeQmFwsL0g

What a talent he was. I think the Leinster ship has sailed, I'm happy with our options there and there would be even more pressure on him to perform here. A move abroad would be on the cards no doubt, if he continues to not be selected for Ireland. I don't think he will, but If he were to leave Munster, they'd be very short on options at 10.

[hugonaut]

Game was over before halftime. Outstanding first forty from Glasgow, but a very weak effort from Munster. To call it flat isn't critical enough, they were dreadful. Complete no-shows from Jack O'Donoghue and John Hodnett in the backrow, a couple of sloppy lineout mistakes from Barron in the headlines and mistake after mistake from Crowley.

Kilcoyne was absolutely demolished by Zander Fagerson at the scrum. He was taken to pieces. Fagerson is a bad match-up for him, but I didn't expect him to be chewed up and spat out by half time.

From my perspective, apart from the the hospital pass to Coombes off the restart, that wasn't an especially egregious performance from Carbery. That is how he has been playing for years.

Nash played really well, looked a handful every time he got the ball.

The story of that match was Glasgow's first half though. They were so smart and so accurate. They made chances and then were clinical in finishing them ... all the while playing very skilful, inventive rugby. Really impressive showing from them.

[elephantman]

It's an absolute travesty what's happened to Carberry. I don't know how much of it is down to the injuries he's suffered or if its down to the way he's been managed. Either way it looks like he'll have to get out of Munster and start again somewhere. It's not working.

I think you’re right. I get the feeling that Rowntree isn’t his biggest fan either. Wouldn’t be a shock to see Crowley start at 10 next weekend.

It’s desperately sad to see Carbery playing so poorly. I’m biased of course but I’ve always thought his 2018 move to Munster was the wrong decision. He should have stayed at Leinster.

It's all Munsters fault that Carbery is playing poorly. Sure.

Joey was not good and that's on Joey. Not many Irish players have had the time money , patience and opportunities invested into them like he has. At some point it's on you to be the player people thought you could be or just get out of the way.

I don’t think anybody has said - or even inferred - that “It’s all Munsters fault that Carbery is playing poorly”

What a silly take.

[paddyor]

Not a great attendance for their last home game of the season.

[Ruckedtobits]

So maybe now we know more about the previous few seasons. It wasn't all down to JvG. Some of the bad days were down to the players. Tonight shows us that there are days a lot of them just don't show up for 40 mins in a game here or there. Why it happens to so many at the same time may yet be somebody's PhD research project in Psychology. But for the present, it's a mystery. There's certainly no logic to it.

Glasgow were good, at times brilliant, in the opening half. But so many Munster players and units were poor, almost abject. Front row, back-row, half-backs and centres never functioned at any level of competence in that initial forty minutes. They repaired many of the inadequacies in the second half. But it was too little, too late and, in fact, only served to make that first-half display even more inexplicable.

Munster's fate is not sealed by that display but it is out of their control as regards the venue of their knock-out games. That will make it harder but not impossible.

[naraic]

So maybe now we know more about the previous few seasons. It wasn't all down to JvG. Some of the bad days were down to the players. Tonight shows us that there are days a lot of them just don't show up for 40 mins in a game here or there. Why it happens to so many at the same time may yet be somebody's PhD research project in Psychology. But for the present, it's a mystery. There's certainly no logic to it.

Glasgow were good, at times brilliant, in the opening half. But so many Munster players and units were poor, almost abject. Front row, back-row, half-backs and centres never functioned at any level of competence in that initial forty minutes. They repaired many of the inadequacies in the second half. But it was too little, too late and, in fact, only served to make that first-half display even more inexplicable.

Munster's fate is not sealed by that display but it is out of their control as regards the venue of their knock-out games. That will make it harder but not impossible.

I feel leadership is a big part of it. I want to say its happened a few times this season when JOD is the captain. There needs to be someone on the field who can give people a bit of a talking to when people don't show up for 5 minutes. Never mind 40 minutes.

In Leinster someone from the leadership group talks to people when their heads drop. When the full team is there Sexton, Ringrose and Ryan share leadership duty, if someone's head drops they get a talking to on the field and pick things up. When the second team is being played Ruddock's leadership is so important. Others step up and help out too.

In Munster leadership is POM or no one. People aren't stepping up and offering the intangible leadership.

[blockhead]

Glasgow's try before HT was tasty, very very tasty.
Hard to see Munster breaking into the top 4 with both Ulster and Glasgow playing at home for the last two games and they're down in RSA with us. A series of unlikely results would have to ensue.
Glasgow are starting to motor now just like Scarlets were in 2017.

[jezzer]

There were plenty of phases where the players were going through the motions, pretending like they had their man and were doing their part, but it was very hollow stuff.

Glasgow playedsome wonderful rugby. That 1st half try down the left touchline was try of the season material. But it all came too easy.

[riocard911]

That performance in general and vs Fagerson in the scrum in particular could have cost Killer his place on the plane to France in the autumn.