Ireland Autumn Internationals 2021

[Keith]

Am I the only one bricking it about Ryans head knock?

I didn't like himself and Doris being risked in a game like this. Hopefully he is ok and worryingly Doris looked groggy after that massive collision before his try.

[CiaranIrl]

Am I the only one bricking it about Ryans head knock?

I Didn't like himself and Doris being risked in a game like this. Hopefully he is ok and worryingly Doris looked groggy after that massive collision before his try.

Yeah, I was the exact same. I really wanted Doris to be taken off as well at half time. You can't help but be concerned about these lads and brain injury, given the stories lately.

On a purely selfish level, Ryan is critical for us (Leinster in this case) over the next couple of HEC games. We can't really replace him in the second row.

[Fan with smartphone]

Tadhg Furlong my man of the match. Made 35 metres. Only Kelleher in the forwards made more (though Doris and VdF were close) and some outrageous hits too.

Tadhg Beirne I thought was just ridiculous.

[IanD]

Healy moves onto 9 tries now, same as Zebo.

So on a Kilo per try basis Healy just shades it.

[ronk]

Pretty much what I was hoping for in terms of solid set piece and aggressive defence. Attack was patchy and far simpler than the last two weeks but was much improved when we changed the halfbacks. Murray just doesn’t suit how we’re trying to play, slowed everything down and was far too eager to go to the boot.

I thought Joey was bang average at ten but his defence was much improved and he was outstanding when he went to fullback. That’s a huge positive I think, he really seemed to get his mojo back as the game went on. If he keeps that defence up for Munster then he’s a much better option.

Disappointed with our kicking game in general. I don’t think we were just trusting our defence, a lot of it was just aimless.

Some of the young lads like Baird, Sheehan, and Casey really stepped up. Happy enough with Harry too considering how badly he needs games. Huge steps forwards this autumn, didn’t see that coming.

That could be the start of a return to form for Carbery. He's not there yet but at least he's improved his defence and had a few good moments. He used to tackle that way years ago.

General comments about Murray are right but I'm not sure how much was he was taking weight off Carbery rather than not able to play faster. I guess we'll see.

Argentina did a really good job of getting in the backfield for the pull back passes and were adapting to our recent tactics. Not sure how much was slower halfbacks and how much was us not throwing to the screen runners. Made our centres less effective though.

[fourthirtythree]

Tadhg Furlong my man of the match. Made 35 metres. Only Kelleher in the forwards made more (though Doris and VdF were close) and some outrageous hits too.

Tadhg Beirne I thought was just ridiculous.

Tackled well, called all the lineout on himself, stole one, and moved over to tighthead lock after prepping for back row!

But that would be harsh on Kelleher who hot all his lineouts, made twice as many metres and led the offloading.

It was a forward anyway.

[wixfjord]

I thought Beirne was excellent, particularly in first half.

VDF, Kelleher, Doris, Furlong the pick of the rest.

No idea how Joey won MOTM, his first 20 was very mixed. Tackled well and looked great when game opened up though.

This autumn series has been characterised by incredible 'all court' performances from some of our forwards. It really is an impressive pack now. My one and only concern would be coming up against a hugely physical side like England & SA and the potential of being shut down a bit. But that's certainly less of a concern than when we would've had Best/Herring, Healy, Stander, POM in there.

We could do with Baird coming good or Ahern making a late run into the squad as second row is probably the lightest area. Maybe TOT proving himself in a few big games also.

[Experimental]

Great stuff from us. Discipline letting down Argentina once again, Lesdesma must be getting sick of all the cards and fouling. Honestly feel sorry for the man, hes doing brilliantly in what looks like really difficult circumstances. Theyd be a real force if they improved that part of their game.
Josh Van Der Flier played great, MOTM for me, Furlong was outstanding, and dare I say has reached even new levels this November.
Thought Matthew Carley had a fantastic game, didnt miss a trick.
We havent won anything yet, but Faz, Catty, Easterby, OConnell and co have really upped their game, and should be very very proud of the way the team is playing. Really going in the right direction and the 6N cant come soon enough

[wixfjord]

One thing I was a bit surprised at yesterday was Ringer's slight selfishness on the ball. There were a few occasions he cut back inside and potentially stifled a move that could've gone a bit wider.

He's very good at that 'against the grain' move generally, but would like him to be a bit more circumspect with using it, as can kill momentum.

[Oldschoolsocks]

One thing I was a bit surprised at yesterday was Ringer's slight selfishness on the ball. There were a few occasions he cut back inside and potentially stifled a move that could've gone a bit wider.

He's very good at that 'against the grain' move generally, but would like him to be a bit more circumspect with using it, as can kill momentum.

This. Did he pass the ball to Balcoune at all?

[the spoofer]

I thought Beirne was excellent, particularly in first half.

VDF, Kelleher, Doris, Furlong the pick of the rest.

No idea how Joey won MOTM, his first 20 was very mixed. Tackled well and looked great when game opened up though.

This autumn series has been characterised by incredible 'all court' performances from some of our forwards. It really is an impressive pack now. My one and only concern would be coming up against a hugely physical side like England & SA and the potential of being shut down a bit. But that's certainly less of a concern than when we would've had Best/Herring, Healy, Stander, POM in there.

We could do with Baird coming good or Ahern making a late run into the squad as second row is probably the lightest area. Maybe TOT proving himself in a few big games also.

I thought Beirne’s defence let him down on more than one occasion

[erskinechilders]

Sorry Ryan Baird's numbers are silly! 56m off four carries.

Where did you get these stats?

[dropkick]

One thing I was a bit surprised at yesterday was Ringer's slight selfishness on the ball. There were a few occasions he cut back inside and potentially stifled a move that could've gone a bit wider.

He's very good at that 'against the grain' move generally, but would like him to be a bit more circumspect with using it, as can kill momentum.

This. Did he pass the ball to Balcoune at all?

He needs to play more heads up rugby. It's not as though he can't pass because he has the ability to pass and kick well.

[dropkick]

Sorry Ryan Baird's numbers are silly! 56m off four carries.

Interesting that Argentina stopped the ball going wide but that resulted in more space for ball carriers. This is the kind of style that's hard to defend.

[riocard911]

One thing I was a bit surprised at yesterday was Ringer's slight selfishness on the ball. There were a few occasions he cut back inside and potentially stifled a move that could've gone a bit wider.

He's very good at that 'against the grain' move generally, but would like him to be a bit more circumspect with using it, as can kill momentum.

This. Did he pass the ball to Balcoune at all?

I've watched the match back and the answer is no. I was quite disappointed by that, as I had been hoping to see Baloucoune get the ball more. I could be completely wrong, but it seems to me Ringer is more likely to cut back inside, if the ball is being transferred thru the backline from left to right, rather than from right to left. Is he perhaps not as confident passing to his right as to his left? It was in the latter direction, that he decided not to pass, despite a glaring overlap, in the 2019 Heino final, if I remember correctly.

[fourthirtythree]

One thing I was a bit surprised at yesterday was Ringer's slight selfishness on the ball. There were a few occasions he cut back inside and potentially stifled a move that could've gone a bit wider.

He's very good at that 'against the grain' move generally, but would like him to be a bit more circumspect with using it, as can kill momentum.

This. Did he pass the ball to Balcoune at all?

He passed nine times, and Balacoune carried nine times so...

I guess?

Where did you get these stats?

https://www.irishrugby.ie/preview/autum ... erformance

Interesting that Argentina stopped the ball going wide but that resulted in more space for ball carriers. This is the kind of style that's hard to defend.

It seems they were prepared for our wingers and edge forwards game, but Kelleher, Josh, Doris, and others (Ringrose in particular) just made huge numbers up the middle.

[erskinechilders]

It's great to see us adapting on our feet. Played to the edge a lot in the previous 2 games. Argentina didn't allow that with their edge defenders coming up very fast and having good spacing. The space therefore was either side of the tackler, with Ireland going through them. Previously we would have just knocked our heads against brick walls.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Great stuff from us. Discipline letting down Argentina once again, Lesdesma must be getting sick of all the cards and fouling. Honestly feel sorry for the man, hes doing brilliantly in what looks like really difficult circumstances. Theyd be a real force if they improved that part of their game.

I dunno, if you pick someone like Lavinini then you get what you deserve really. I enjoyed POM having a pop at him but it was a bit rich considering he did something very similar against Wales

[Oldschoolsocks]

One thing I was a bit surprised at yesterday was Ringer's slight selfishness on the ball. There were a few occasions he cut back inside and potentially stifled a move that could've gone a bit wider.

He's very good at that 'against the grain' move generally, but would like him to be a bit more circumspect with using it, as can kill momentum.

This. Did he pass the ball to Balcoune at all?

He passed nine times, and Balacoune carried nine times so...

I guess?

Where did you get these stats?

https://www.irishrugby.ie/preview/autum ... erformance

Interesting that Argentina stopped the ball going wide but that resulted in more space for ball carriers. This is the kind of style that's hard to defend.

It seems they were prepared for our wingers and edge forwards game, but Kelleher, Josh, Doris, and others (Ringrose in particular) just made huge numbers up the middle.

We’re any of those passes to Balcoune?

[jezzer]

Hello again all.

Back perusing the board after a longish self-imposed exile. Hope all doing well. Hard not to on the rugby front at least after the start to this season.

Thought I'd share a few thoughts on where we seem to be.

Gameplan-wise, I thought the Argie game was very useful and instructive. We're not always going to have soft shoulders and gaping holes in the D, even when our 1-3-2-2 shape is clicking. It was important to validate against a very tough (albeit heavily penalised) defence that the power game is still there for when it's needed and that it hasn't been deemphasised as the team works on being expansive. I don't think it was necessary for us to go away from the Joe Schmidt style because it was boring and abrasive. What was necessary was to go away from it because it was predictable and because JS didn't believe in Plan Bs.

Now it seems we're building more than one way to win, which has been my bugbear with Ireland for more than a decade. It's in the knockout games where you have to show them new looks or you get nullified. The 1-3-2-2 isn't so radical that it can't be figured out to a fair degree so we need to keep adding stuff to the arsenal and not throwing out old JS-era basics that still work. In that respect, we can be very optimistic at last that Ireland will surprise teams for the next two years, or at the very least adapt in-game to how they're being defended.

The other big strategic takeaway for me has been how Ireland are working so hard off-ball to reshape. It's that hard work that allows players be in position early enough to be able to attack the ball and the gainline and not get it static. Front foot ball for me is a function of the reload. Quick reloads give attacking ball, which gives positive collisions which give fast rucks. The same attitude to reloading is being seen in defence where guys like Keenan and Conway have been flying around in the backfield to cover space and fill gaps.

I'm not a fan of an Ireland team not being representative fo the whole island. I don't personally like seeing 12 Leinster players in there any more than I did seeing 9 or 10 Munstermen in their heyday. Not that i'd go for affirmative action, but I hope Nucifora has a concrete plan for improving player pathways in th other 3 provinces. My feeling is that Farrell and Catt consciously wanted a heavy Leinster contingent in place in order to bed in the "new" style. Hopefully, as more players from other provinces are brought into squads/meetups, plays, tactics, calls and alighments can trickle through everywhere. In fairness, none of the Leinster players called on have given any excuses to those watching for them not to be picked.

Squad-wise, things are looking pretty healthy.

On the prop front, I don't agree with the thought that the depth is lacking. I thought Bealham was terrific against NZ and TOT was pretty handy against Arg. Healy is still a beast as a bench option and behind him there is maybe a dropoff to the pool of other options, but it's not drastic. There are no more superlatives for Furlong's performance vs Argentina but it's become so normal for him to be stellar maybe we can just say he was good. Porter is the missing ingredient for this pack and he's what's tipped them into world-class level. He does everythign well and manages it at a frightening pace with no real let-up for 60 mins.

We've gone from desert to oasis at hooker in 2 years. Does anything need to be said, other than I hope the Sheehan hype and the typical meeja/fan proclivity for the next guy doesnt diminish what Kelleher is doing out on the pitch. Herring and Heff are very capable understudies.

I have to watch the Arg game again to see how Baird held up in the physical exchanges and set piece, but his open field performance is another reminder that it's not a 3-lock race for Ireland. I feel bad for Dillane in that maybe the expectations for him are too high when he's picked - in other words that he has to do 150% of what the others have to do in order to be considered a shoe-in in the squad. But he's never really grasped the nettle
fully so the door is open for the 4th lock or 4/6 player.

The back row is an embarassment of riches and yet the top 4 look very tough to dislodge. Timoney is going to get a real shot at it and he deserves it. The 7s programme has been so good to a few of the players who have switched back and he's one of them. He has a huge motor, is a handy distributor and is a great carrier - Ulster with him and Vermeulen will be scary. When POM finally heads west the ideal like-for-like replacement is Leavy, but I get the feeling he's not in Faz's plans for now. Timoney is in the driving seat, maybe even when Connors recovers.
What the current back row do that no other world trio does as well is use their feet through contact. All three of Doris, VDF and Conan are elite at it.

Can we please stop plámássing Murray and just face facts that he doesn't fit. JGP, Casey, McGrath, Blade and Doak (not to mention bete-noire Cooney) all fit the profile to varying degrees. WE DON'T NEED CM ANYMORE AND IT'S NOT TREASON TO ADMIT IT. I'd prefer we put more effort into blooding and trying our SH options than our OH options.

On the topic of which, what is Harry Byrne doing getting test caps? That kid is not ready. I personally don't believe he's ready for Leinster in a HEC game, let along in green. I can imagine he trains really well, but when he's thrown in he proceeds to be wild and impatient. Exuberance of youth maybe, but go and figure that out against Cardiff then come back to me. Carbury is doing pretty fine. If he hadn't to deal with Murray playing inside him he'd have been much bettter ball in hand vs a constantly offside Arg line. His defence was iffy against NZ, I thought it was terrific yesterday. His placekicking is a thing of beauty. Assuming Carty is still not a consideration (an error in my book, tho the pacekicking is an issue) Joey is the clear backup. If he were French or Kiwi, Frawley would have had a crack in the 10 jersey by now. We seem to be fixated on only playing him at 12 now, which is a waste considering Bundee and Robbie are there.

In the centre, there's a ton of positive and a few niggles. Bundee was awesome against NZ. Everyone is lauding the pass from Keenan to Lowe for his try but the real peach was Aki's to Keenan. I'd like to see Bundee vary his offload weaponry - he has the one-handed scoop offload but when it's not on I'd like him to be more inventive a la Lowe. Henshaw needs more time to rate but on his 2021 form in general, he's exceptional. Ringer has been sublime in so may areas it seems churlish to pick at him but his proclivity to step back inside and dip the head for 4m when he has overloads outside him is reaching McFadden proportions.

I'd like to see Connacht's Farrell be brought in when fit and for Hume to get more exposure to the squad. McCloskey doesn't fit for me - I'd be looking elsewhere.

Back three is the area where all test teams have the most options and where there is often the most rotation. While Addison is out, I don't think they can improve on the 5 leading players they have in Conway, Lowe, Keenan, Balacoune and Earls. But it's the area where you always get surprise guys. Keep an eye on Porch and McIlroy heading towards the RWC.