Summer tour of Dublin 2021

[ronk]

Most of the experienced players got time off and Ringrose is injured. Faz could stick with Ryan but POM is standout in that squad in terms of leadership experience.

Stockdale is the experience in the backs but I think Keenan should be in there because of the way he glues things together. But then Keenan is also getting too important for Ireland, so maybe just put Stockdale at fullback.

[erskinechilders]

I'd pick Burns ahead of Carbery on current form. Next week is one for Harry Byrne though.

I think Harry Byrne is injured.. there's been no sign of him in any photos for 2 weeks and Lowry has stayed with the squad. Don't have any expectation of seeing him next week.

Our pack there should be formidable. But, James Ryan looks like he is still struggling with that injury. He’s a man who has had 2 concussions in internationals in the past and here we are pushing him for a game like this. Caelan Doris: 2 concussions in last year - do we need to be playing him here? Particularly with Coombes on the bench.

I'm sorry but this sh*t annoys the hell out of me. Yes they've missed matches as a result of head injuries but to insinuate that the IRFU & Leinster are not looking after the players is ridiculous. Doris was given 4 months off to protect him and Ryan was rested at various times too. You have ZERO medical info on the players. Both Doris & Ryan need game time and experience ( Ryan to a lesser degree obviously ) and if the medics and doctors have cleared both players to play then Farrell has every right to pick them.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Some good things some bad things. Farrell should be feeling the pressure now. Since he took over the only good performance was the last match against England.


I like Farrell and like what I hear about him wanting to speed the play up a bit but actions speak louder than words. They play great stuff in patches but a lot of the time it looks muddled and they resort to aimless box kicks. Today was a poor overall performance but one of the tries came from some lovely tip on passes.


If you want to play fast exciting rugby then pick the players for it. All the Japanese backs have quick feet and look for soft shoulders to attack. They keep changing direction which gives them opportunities to offload. They don't have to 'win the collisions'.


The conditions helped ireland in the end and it's another win under Farrell but a lot of those have been lucky. They need a big performance next week.

There were times when we kicked when we had really good momentum and platforms to play off and then others when we were crying out to kick but just kept going side to side and then backwards near the halfway line.

I know that you always want to kick on your own terms if possible but it was a real mess in the first half.

[Fan with smartphone]

[quote=ronk post_id=783655 time=<a href="tel:1625338290">1625338290</a> user_id=2656]
I'd pick Burns ahead of Carbery on current form. Next week is one for Harry Byrne though.

I think Harry Byrne is injured.. there's been no sign of him in any photos for 2 weeks and Lowry has stayed with the squad. Don't have any expectation of seeing him next week.

[quote="Fan with smartphone" post_id=783651 time=<a href="tel:1625326391">1625326391</a> user_id=8542]
Our pack there should be formidable. But, James Ryan looks like he is still struggling with that injury. He’s a man who has had 2 concussions in internationals in the past and here we are pushing him for a game like this. Caelan Doris: 2 concussions in last year - do we need to be playing him here? Particularly with Coombes on the bench.
[/quote]

I'm sorry but this sh*t annoys the hell out of me. Yes they've missed matches as a result of head injuries but to insinuate that the IRFU & Leinster are not looking after the players is ridiculous. Doris was given 4 months off to protect him and Ryan was rested at various times too. You have ZERO medical info on the players. Both Doris & Ryan need game time and experience ( Ryan to a lesser degree obviously ) and if the medics and doctors have cleared both players to play then Farrell has every right to pick them.
[/quote]

That’s not what I’m insinuating. I don’t agree that either player need game time or experience in these games. I don’t see what it achieves. I don’t think they are good selections on balance for these games.

[ronk]

Ryan was visibly in pain both during the warm up and after getting bent at one stage.

I get that it was important for him to be available for the Lions and to captain the side in a strategic match. I hope he gets long enough now to get fully right, regardless of the cost to next season.

[riocard911]

Ryan was visibly in pain both during the warm up and after getting bent at one stage.

I get that it was important for him to be available for the Lions and to captain the side in a strategic match. I hope he gets long enough now to get fully right, regardless of the cost to next season.

+1!!!

[Oldschool]

The number of missed tackles by our lads was the most negative aspect for me.

Too many missed tackles always begs the question why.
One reason but not the only one.
The Japanese were doing a lot of off the ball "interfering" with our players as they (Japanese) came back inside.
This had the effect of our defenders being late into position.
Ref should have picked up on this stragglers tactic by Japan but didn't for whatever reason.

[Ruckedtobits]

Had Ireland beaten Japan in RWC 2019, it is unlikely it would have been considered a surprise. Had they beaten Japan in that game with a second-string team missing at least 10 presumed starters, it would have been considered a strategic and coaching triumph.

To criticise the value of Saturday's win is to disrespect and undervalue the achievements and current status of Japan within World rugby. Certainly, Ireland were far from flawless but the qualities that emerged were not without merit and the overall victory deserves acclaim.

The Irish team and Management were on a hiding to nothing in the fixture. They had assembled an essentially new team, without any warm-up fixtures and taken on a team, the majority of whom were familiar with each other, who had already had two good fixtures against their Super Rugby colleagues and the Lions in successive weeks and were clearly a more cohesive unit from the outset.

The Irish team and supporters should be pleased at this victory and should look forward to the US game with anticipation of more to come. Next Saturday's team will be different again and their opponents' game against England will again give them a teamwork advantage against their hosts.

I certainly look forward to that encounter and the introduction of a number of less experienced players to see how they can perform at this level. They won't all be stars and some may not perform to expectations but that is what is a realistic expectation from games of this nature. If we can emerge from these two games with five players new to international rugby having proved their capability at this level, it will be a very successful summer for Ireland. And yes, we need a victory on Saturday as well.

[Dave Cahill]

Had Ireland beaten Japan in RWC 2019, it is unlikely it would have been considered a surprise. Had they beaten Japan in that game with a second-string team missing at least 10 presumed starters, it would have been considered a strategic and coaching triumph.

To criticise the value of Saturday's win is to disrespect and undervalue the achievements and current status of Japan within World rugby. Certainly, Ireland were far from flawless but the qualities that emerged were not without merit and the overall victory deserves acclaim.

The Irish team and Management were on a hiding to nothing in the fixture. They had assembled an essentially new team, without any warm-up fixtures and taken on a team, the majority of whom were familiar with each other, who had already had two good fixtures against their Super Rugby colleagues and the Lions in successive weeks and were clearly a more cohesive unit from the outset.

The Irish team and supporters should be pleased at this victory and should look forward to the US game with anticipation of more to come. Next Saturday's team will be different again and their opponents' game against England will again give them a teamwork advantage against their hosts.

I certainly look forward to that encounter and the introduction of a number of less experienced players to see how they can perform at this level. They won't all be stars and some may not perform to expectations but that is what is a realistic expectation from games of this nature. If we can emerge from these two games with five players new to international rugby having proved their capability at this level, it will be a very successful summer for Ireland. And yes, we need a victory on Saturday as well.

We toured Japan in 2017, played two tests and beat them handily both times with 11 presumed starters missing. It was not considered a strategic and coaching triumph.

[Flash Gordon]

Had Ireland beaten Japan in RWC 2019, it is unlikely it would have been considered a surprise. Had they beaten Japan in that game with a second-string team missing at least 10 presumed starters, it would have been considered a strategic and coaching triumph.

To criticise the value of Saturday's win is to disrespect and undervalue the achievements and current status of Japan within World rugby. Certainly, Ireland were far from flawless but the qualities that emerged were not without merit and the overall victory deserves acclaim.

The Irish team and Management were on a hiding to nothing in the fixture. They had assembled an essentially new team, without any warm-up fixtures and taken on a team, the majority of whom were familiar with each other, who had already had two good fixtures against their Super Rugby colleagues and the Lions in successive weeks and were clearly a more cohesive unit from the outset.

The Irish team and supporters should be pleased at this victory and should look forward to the US game with anticipation of more to come. Next Saturday's team will be different again and their opponents' game against England will again give them a teamwork advantage against their hosts.

I certainly look forward to that encounter and the introduction of a number of less experienced players to see how they can perform at this level. They won't all be stars and some may not perform to expectations but that is what is a realistic expectation from games of this nature. If we can emerge from these two games with five players new to international rugby having proved their capability at this level, it will be a very successful summer for Ireland. And yes, we need a victory on Saturday as well.

Despite their RWC heroics, Japan are ranked 10th in the world just ahead of Fiji, we are 4th, we should expect to beat them at home. The USA are 16th just ahead of Uruguay, we should hammer them. The alarming thing for me was that Japan played exactly as we expected them to play and we struggled to defend against them. Meanwhile, We played exactly the same way we always do, shuffling the ball along the line predictably or sending the big centres into contact. Did we see any level of progression in the way we played? I don't think so. Speaking of which, I still don't see Joey Carbery progressing either.

On individual performances thought Josh was outstanding (again), he's very unlucky not to be in South Africa. JGP was good too as was Keenan and Dorris with ball in hand, that aside, there were some pretty average performances and a few poor performances - Larmour and Dillane for example.

Was also disappointed to see Coombes and Casey get a combined 12 minutes.

I know the Lions were up against a much lower calibre of opposition but the difference in coaching was pretty obvious. We really really need an attack coach.

[ronk]

Casey was the only cover (by moving JPG) for 7 positions from 43 minutes into the game. We had a makeshift backline and probably would have pulled Carbery off with his knock if we could have.

I'd be raging at Faz if he'd ignored the situation and replaced one of our best players for the sake of sticking to the plan.

I thought our backline play improved when we had to manage without 2 of our worst passers in the backline.

[JB1973]

Really enjoyable game of rugby for the neutral, japan are a joy to watch and scored some great trys, while Ireland more than played their part

I thought Doris was motm and he is a real talent if he can stay fit, jdvf was into everything and is a very good player, your centres are not the most talented players but they are big strong guys who run and hard and take some stopping

Out of curio why is Mcgrath not involved ? injured or out of favour?

[riocard911]

Flash Gordon: "I know the Lions were up against a much lower calibre of opposition but the difference in coaching was pretty obvious. We really really need an attack coach."

I found the contrast in style and execution depressing, if I'm being honest.

[cormac]

Chris Farrell (HIA) and Jordan Larmour (groin injury) won't be fit to face the USA on Saturday.

Peter O'Mahony has been let off a week early on his holidays.

https://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2021/070 ... usa-clash/

[hugonaut]

I know the Lions were up against a much lower calibre of opposition but the difference in coaching was pretty obvious. We really really need an attack coach.

From the outside looking in, it seems like [some of] the coaching staff talk about playing in possession one way, while picking a backline that can't really play that way.

Andy Farrell tends to do press conferences with Oasis-type lyrics – almost everything he says is generic, quasi-inspirational stuff. I think that's who he is: he's a straightforward guy and he looks for positives. I've been reading his comments for a couple of years and have settled on the opinion that he's not willing to give a lot of insight to anybody outside the team bubble.

Maybe Farrell thought we could use two big centres to get over the gainline against Japan and we'd leave the 'heads-up' rugby for another day. But it seems like you're never really going to get anything tactical from him in a post-match presser.

[ronk]

I think Farrell was going to rely on Ringrose and went straight down the depth chart rather than consider creativity at centre. Part of that is he likes 2 big centres.

[ronk]

And actually Fax basically tried to recreate the Munster backline.

[Ruckedtobits]

Just how experimental can Andy Farrell be next Saturday? On the face of it he could really thrown in a team with very little experience such as:

1. Dooley; 2. Herring; 3. O'Toole; 4. Molony; 5. Wyncherly; 6. Coombes; 7: Timoney; 8. Boyle; 9. Blade; 10: Byrne H; 11. Daly S; 12. Daly T: 13. Hume: 14. Baloucoune; 15. Addison.

Personally I don't think he should, or will, go with such an inexperienced roster, but the list is a fairly good indication of how much learning has been going on in this Irish training camp over the past fortnight / three weeks.

I'd like to see the following starting team & subs:

15. S Daly; 14. Balaucoune; 13. Addison; 12. T Daly; 11. Conway; 10. Byrne; 9. Blade;
1. Dooley; 2. Kelleher; 3. O'Toole; 4. Jas Ryan; 5. Baird; 6. Doris; 7. Timoney; 8. Coombes.
Bench: 16. Herring; 17. Ed Byrne; 18. J Ryan; 19. Molony; 20. Boyle; 21. Casey; 22. Carbury; 23. Keenan

[hugonaut]

Forwards [1-8]: P. Dooley, R. Kelleher, T. O'Toole, R. Baird, J. Ryan, G. Coombes, J. van der Flier, C. Doris;
Backs [9-15]: J. Gibson-Park, H. Byrne, R. Baloucoune, T. Daly, W. Addison, J. Stockdale, H. Keenan;
Subs [16-23]: R. Herring, D. Kilcoyne, F. Bealham, R. Molony, N. Timoney, C. Blade, J. Carbery, S. Daly.

I like Dooley's size over Ed Byrne. Tom O'Toole shouldn't get massive stress from an American scrum, so I think this is a good fixture for him to debut in. Baird did exceptionally well off the bench against Japan and should start this one. Coombes to start in the backrow – whether at No6 or No8 is much of a much muchness to me. So many good ball-carriers in that pack, and four line-out options. It's young as well – JVDF at 28 is the oldest player in the starting eight.

I think Harry should start at outhalf, and I'd put him with Gibson Park, who he is familiar with. I would seriously consider playing McCloskey and Addison together in the centres because they play at Ulster together [and McCloskey played well last weekend] but Tom Daly has played so well this season that I feel excluding him would go against the idea that you should reward form. Baloucoune and Stockdale on the wings are two weapons with pace and height - definitely cross-kick targets, and big open-play threats. Hugo Keenan starts because I love watching him play.

With the subs I've gone with Blade over Casey; I like Blade's breaking game. Casey is unfortunate that he had to sit on the bench for most of last weekend's game, but unfortunately that can happen. He's a good player and will get another chance down the line, I'm sure.

I'd go with Molony over Wycherly, but wouldn't be surprised or put out if it went the other way. Timoney over Boyle, but again I could see it going the other way.

EDIT: Getting people's initials right.

[ronk]

Dooley, Herring, O'Toole
Wycherley, Ryan (c)
Coombes, Timoney, van der Flier
Casey, Byrne
Daly, Hume
Conway, Addison, Baloucoune

Subs: Kilcoyne, Heffernan, Bealham, Molony, Baird, Blade, Carbery, Daly

Depth chart needs Dooley and O’Toole so they need to be on it. Ryan is captain and Molony knows him too well to learn anything so Wycherley. Coombes is a given but I think Boyle or Timoney should get a shot. Casey’s development is too important for other considerations. Byrne might be the starting outhalf for the RWC.

Tom Daly is a form selection, but not one I’m confident in. Hume could be a bolter, maybe partnered with McCloskey though.

Depth at fullback is too important and Keenan could shift to the wing if Addison restablishes himself and Fax wants to play both. There are too many centres. Conway is experience and he hasn’t been used. Baloucoune another potential bolter.

Subs are all around long enough you know they’re reliable. But still some development.