lions team for second test? - Speculation

[exiledinmunster]

Perhaps POC's position should be discussed. Captaincy seems to be weighing him down and his game is suffering. He is playing nowhere near to the standard required

[Terraceman]

Perhaps POC's position should be discussed. Captaincy seems to be weighing him down and his game is suffering. He is playing nowhere near to the standard required

It would be devastating for O'Connell but from a team perspective it could just work. There's only one real candidate for a replacement.... no prizes for guessing who.

As regards replacements in the forwards there is very little options. Wallace was chosen because he was more physical than Williams, Heaslip cause Powell couldn't clear out effectively at the ruck. The Lions won't look at wholesale changes. Adam Jones will come in but I think Mears will start again. Rees was very dodgey at the lineout in the warm up games.

[claire_m]

Perhaps POC's position should be discussed. Captaincy seems to be weighing him down and his game is suffering. He is playing nowhere near to the standard required

It would be devastating for O'Connell but from a team perspective it could just work. There's only one real candidate for a replacement.... no prizes for guessing who.

As regards replacements in the forwards there is very little options. Wallace was chosen because he was more physical than Williams, Heaslip cause Powell couldn't clear out effectively at the ruck. The Lions won't look at wholesale changes. Adam Jones will come in but I think Mears will start again. Rees was very dodgey at the lineout in the warm up games.

And as soon as Rees came on, he punched someone.

i'd drop Vickery. Regardless of whether the penalties were all his fault, the scrum seemed more solid with Jones on. I think Jenkins had a good game and i'd keep him. Hooker, I don't rate Mears, Rees did OK, bar his discipline & I can't even remember who the other hooker is!

2nd row - PoC has been poor all tour. I also don't get his positioning, he seems to get into the first receiver position too often. Wasn't paying too much attention to AWJ, but I think the 2nd row partnership will change.

Back row - bar score two tries (I think he was in the right place at the right time on both occasions), I wasn't impressed with Croft. Think he's had a poor tour (despite the press that he is the new messiah!). Think Williams should start.

Scrummy, well, I'd not keep Phillips, I'd not want Ellis and Blair isn't playing well enough. Cusiter, Care & Peel would all offer something, but hey, they're not in SA, so I don't know what to do. Probably keep Phillips...

Outhalf - if hook is fit, I'd start him. Jones was OK, missed his pennos (I didn't see the first 20 mins, so I don't know who bad these misses were) but I'd not start him. I've not been that impressed with RoG tho - I don't think his game suits the Lions (as someone else said). all he would do is kick the ball, not what we should be doing.

Wings - i'd keep them.

Centres - I'd keep them, maybe ask Drico not to kick so much...

Full back - if Byrne is fit, he has been the standout fullback of the tour so far (bar yesterday), I'd start him.

Tactics - sort out the breakdown (!) Don't give away stupid pennos. Don't kick the ball away when we have it. OK, that's very simplistic, but if we don't have the ball, we can't score.

[true blue 06]

jamie being dropped is a bit laughable...its not like there is a good replacement snapping at his heels. wallace hadn't a great game either. heaslip didn't do much wrong, carried well in the second half but when there is a scrum going constantly backwards its very difficult for a no.8 to look good, he however managed to play better than Spies.

[Terraceman]

jamie being dropped is a bit laughable...its not like there is a good replacement snapping at his heels.

Unfortunately thats the situation in so many positions. It makes you wonder was there method to Woodwards madness in bringing such a large squad to New Zealand 4 years ago. Surely not???

[Aussiedub]

Jenkins, Rees, Jones - More power in the scrum but Rees has to hit his jumpers
DOC/POC - Good pairing together and DOC does an awful lot of close in work and as No2 jumper is probably the best lineout option
Croft, Williams, Heaslip - Hopefully with the scrum going better we won't be on the backfoot so much and Williams can move the play around (is a gamble)
Phillips/ROG - We can't afford to miss penalty goals if we are going to win and Jones hasn't done much better than ROG this tour
Luke, Roberts, BOD, Bowe - Same as last week but bring in Luke as a footballer ahead of Monye
Kearney - Byrne not fully fit and has been a bit haphazard with his kicking etc on tour...

Hayes, Ford, AWJ, Wallace, Williams, Jones, Darcy

[ronk]

There's a school of thought that says that Vickery will be desperate to make amends. He's the sort of guy who can pull out a big performance.

The humiliation in the pool against SA helped spur England on to reach the World Cup final. Vickery was an important part of that.

That's not necessarily a strong enough argument, but it's worth bearing in mind. That and the only alternative would be to pick a very late call up ahead of him in the XXII.

[leinsterlank]

Perhaps POC's position should be discussed. Captaincy seems to be weighing him down and his game is suffering. He is playing nowhere near to the standard required

This is the most laughbale thing on this thread!There is no way on earth the captain will be stripped!It would destroy POC, and what image would it convey to SA? Plus it would mean the management were wrong. I also dont think there are better 2nd rows on the tour so he would still have to play! BOD's influence is there regardless of the title.

I dont see the debate over heaslip as valid, he had a quiet game at the borrom of the rucks but he has been a standout player all season and is in good form also. As said earlier you cant make wholesale changes ad heaslip surely wont be one of them!

Monye's lack of clinicality in the game, and some weak positioning has surely nominated him for change! A change on the team will effect continuity the least and lukes ability to score from nothing is surely a bonus! Kearney wouldnt be the worse decision though if byrne is back!

[Avenger]

Jenkins, Rees, Jones - More power in the scrum but Rees has to hit his jumpers
DOC/POC - Good pairing together and DOC does an awful lot of close in work and as No2 jumper is probably the best lineout option
Croft, Williams, Heaslip - Hopefully with the scrum going better we won't be on the backfoot so much and Williams can move the play around (is a gamble)
Phillips/ROG - We can't afford to miss penalty goals if we are going to win and Jones hasn't done much better than ROG this tour
Luke, Roberts, BOD, Bowe - Same as last week but bring in Luke as a footballer ahead of Monye
Kearney - Byrne not fully fit and has been a bit haphazard with his kicking etc on tour...

Hayes, Ford, AWJ, Wallace, Williams, Jones, Darcy

I'd pretty much go with that team, but I'd keep Wallace in there and have Williams on the bench. Maybe put Hines on the bench too as I reckon he'd have a bigger impact than AWJ who was anomonous on Saturday. Ferris and Fla have been huge losses. Would have been definate test starters.

No way should POC lose captaincy. IMO he didn't have a great game on Saturday but he came into it in the second half, which shows great leadership IMO. Players can't be at their top level at all times but how they respond shows their character and POC has that in abundance. I'm sure he'll be a lot better next week.

[TrapperChamonix]

Perhaps POC's position should be discussed. Captaincy seems to be weighing him down and his game is suffering. He is playing nowhere near to the standard required

This is the most laughbale thing on this thread!There is no way on earth the captain will be stripped!It would destroy POC, and what image would it convey to SA? Plus it would mean the management were wrong. I also dont think there are better 2nd rows on the tour so he would still have to play! BOD's influence is there regardless of the title.

Agreed. POC was a good choice of captain and remains so.

[berniemac67]

lots of interesting comments, but got to wonder if we were all watching the same game?

i agree with most that we need to shake up the pack, add some bulk for the scrum. my fear is that this will play into the boks' hands. they deliberately kept the ball tight on saturday to target the "mobile" but lightweight pack (duh, who'd have guessed?). we bulk it up and reduce mobility, and spies and pals will have a field day.

thank god for peter de villiers or 2005 would have been a fond memory. not sure if it's gatland or if geech has suddenly lost it, but we were shocking. thankfully the boks are not as fabulous as we were led to believe, and their arrogance almost cost them. However, with no disrespect to BOD, roberts, phillips and others who played fine games, the lions weren't even at the races and the men in green are unlikely to make similar mistakes again next weekend.

[AidanSloan]

1- Anthony Foley
2- Anthony Foley
3- Anthony Foley
4- Anthony Foley
5- POC
6- Anthony FOley
7- Wallace
8-Heaslip
9-Anthony Foley
10-ROG
11-Luke
12-Anthony Foley
13-BOD
14-Bowe
15-Kearney

That should get the job done

[shezba]

1- Anthony Foley
2- Anthony Foley
3- Anthony Foley
4- Anthony Foley
5- POC
6- Anthony FOley
7- Wallace
8-Heaslip
9-Anthony Foley
10-ROG
11-Luke
12-Anthony Foley
13-BOD
14-Bowe
15-Kearney

That should get the job done

Nice. I like the way you dodged the question of who should be captain too.

[dipper]

1. Jenkins
2. Rees
3. A Jones
4. DOC
5. POC (Captain)
6. Croft
7. Wallace
8. Heaslip
9. Phillips
10. ROG
11. Fitzgerald
12. Roberts
13. BOD
14. Bowe
15. Kearney

16. Ford
17. Sheridan
18. Hines
19. M Williams
20. Ellis
21. Hook
22. Byrne

[dipper]

Double post

[the spoofer]

Perhaps POC's position should be discussed. Captaincy seems to be weighing him down and his game is suffering. He is playing nowhere near to the standard required

It would be devastating for O'Connell but from a team perspective it could just work. There's only one real candidate for a replacement.... no prizes for guessing who.

As regards replacements in the forwards there is very little options. Wallace was chosen because he was more physical than Williams, Heaslip cause Powell couldn't clear out effectively at the ruck. The Lions won't look at wholesale changes. Adam Jones will come in but I think Mears will start again. Rees was very dodgey at the lineout in the warm up games.

And as soon as Rees came on, he punched someone.

i'd drop Vickery. Regardless of whether the penalties were all his fault, the scrum seemed more solid with Jones on. I think Jenkins had a good game and i'd keep him. Hooker, I don't rate Mears, Rees did OK, bar his discipline & I can't even remember who the other hooker is!

2nd row - PoC has been poor all tour. I also don't get his positioning, he seems to get into the first receiver position too often. Wasn't paying too much attention to AWJ, but I think the 2nd row partnership will change.

Back row - bar score two tries (I think he was in the right place at the right time on both occasions), I wasn't impressed with Croft. Think he's had a poor tour (despite the press that he is the new messiah!). Think Williams should start.

Scrummy, well, I'd not keep Phillips, I'd not want Ellis and Blair isn't playing well enough. Cusiter, Care & Peel would all offer something, but hey, they're not in SA, so I don't know what to do. Probably keep Phillips...

Outhalf - if hook is fit, I'd start him. Jones was OK, missed his pennos (I didn't see the first 20 mins, so I don't know who bad these misses were) but I'd not start him. I've not been that impressed with RoG tho - I don't think his game suits the Lions (as someone else said). all he would do is kick the ball, not what we should be doing.

Wings - i'd keep them.

Centres - I'd keep them, maybe ask Drico not to kick so much...

Full back - if Byrne is fit, he has been the standout fullback of the tour so far (bar yesterday), I'd start him.

Tactics - sort out the breakdown (!) Don't give away stupid pennos. Don't kick the ball away when we have it. OK, that's very simplistic, but if we don't have the ball, we can't score.

Rees didnt punch anyone and it was an absolute bullshit penalty.

[Armchair]

My Team would be;

1. Jenkins
2. Rees
3. A Jones
4. Shaw
5. POC (Captain)
6. Croft
7. Wallace
8. Heaslip
9. Phillips
10. ROG
11. Fitzgerald
12. Roberts
13. BOD
14. Bowe
15. Kearney

16. Ford
17. Hayes
18. Hines
19. M Williams
20. Ellis
21. Jones
22. Byrne

[ronk]

1- Anthony Foley
2- Anthony Foley
3- Anthony Foley
4- Anthony Foley
5- POC
6- Anthony FOley
7- Wallace
8-Heaslip
9-Anthony Foley
10-ROG
11-Luke
12-Anthony Foley
13-BOD
14-Bowe
15-Kearney

That should get the job done

Nice. I like the way you dodged the question of who should be captain too.

Anthony Foley. Duh!

[CiaranIrl]

Centres - I'd keep them, maybe ask Drico not to kick so much...

Only very politely though...

[downsouthdukin]

It would be devastating for O'Connell but from a team perspective it could just work. There's only one real candidate for a replacement.... no prizes for guessing who.

As regards replacements in the forwards there is very little options. Wallace was chosen because he was more physical than Williams, Heaslip cause Powell couldn't clear out effectively at the ruck. The Lions won't look at wholesale changes. Adam Jones will come in but I think Mears will start again. Rees was very dodgey at the lineout in the warm up games.

And as soon as Rees came on, he punched someone.

i'd drop Vickery. Regardless of whether the penalties were all his fault, the scrum seemed more solid with Jones on. I think Jenkins had a good game and i'd keep him. Hooker, I don't rate Mears, Rees did OK, bar his discipline & I can't even remember who the other hooker is!

2nd row - PoC has been poor all tour. I also don't get his positioning, he seems to get into the first receiver position too often. Wasn't paying too much attention to AWJ, but I think the 2nd row partnership will change.

Back row - bar score two tries (I think he was in the right place at the right time on both occasions), I wasn't impressed with Croft. Think he's had a poor tour (despite the press that he is the new messiah!). Think Williams should start.

Scrummy, well, I'd not keep Phillips, I'd not want Ellis and Blair isn't playing well enough. Cusiter, Care & Peel would all offer something, but hey, they're not in SA, so I don't know what to do. Probably keep Phillips...

Outhalf - if hook is fit, I'd start him. Jones was OK, missed his pennos (I didn't see the first 20 mins, so I don't know who bad these misses were) but I'd not start him. I've not been that impressed with RoG tho - I don't think his game suits the Lions (as someone else said). all he would do is kick the ball, not what we should be doing.

Wings - i'd keep them.

Centres - I'd keep them, maybe ask Drico not to kick so much...

Full back - if Byrne is fit, he has been the standout fullback of the tour so far (bar yesterday), I'd start him.

Tactics - sort out the breakdown (!) Don't give away stupid pennos. Don't kick the ball away when we have it. OK, that's very simplistic, but if we don't have the ball, we can't score.[/quote]


this is probably the worst analysis i have read regarding the previous gamer and future selection, and i include stephen jones in that!1