Leinster Academy 22-23

[cormac]

Ben Griffin looks to be worth another look to me, rate him better than Lasisi tbh.

his body type and foot speed probably doesnt fit ideal leinster tighthead but id still get him in over the summer.

I can't understand how a province hasn't come in for Griffin. Ulster are crying out for THs.

It's possible I'm mixing him up with another player but have heard that a young Clontarf prop will be training with Ulster in pre-season.

[Ruckedtobits]

I went along to the Aviva yesterday for the AIL final, and have to say the Academy contingent definitely didn't stand out.

Colm deBuitléar agrees with you!! In his post match interview he mentioned that there were pro and academy players getting 'smoked' by AIL players

Saw that afterwards and thought it wasn't the classiest look from him.

Irish speakers usually say what they mean. Maybe he forgot he was talking English, or maybe he's correct.

[mildlyinterested]

Academy players are usually 19, 20, 21.. the top club players in AIL are often a good bit older than that and more developed physically and have more cohesion with team mates as they arent also training with Leinster.

[mildlyinterested]

Ben Griffin looks to be worth another look to me, rate him better than Lasisi tbh.

his body type and foot speed probably doesnt fit ideal leinster tighthead but id still get him in over the summer.

I can't understand how a province hasn't come in for Griffin. Ulster are crying out for THs.

It's possible I'm mixing him up with another player but have heard that a young Clontarf prop will be training with Ulster in pre-season.

Yep thats him. He was involved with Leinster A this season, looks like he is headed North.

[mildlyinterested]

Standout CBC Monkstown backrow Charlie Meagher made Leinster schools squad, was part of extended squad last summer as a under-17. One to watch.

[Keith]

I can't understand how a province hasn't come in for Griffin. Ulster are crying out for THs.

It's possible I'm mixing him up with another player but have heard that a young Clontarf prop will be training with Ulster in pre-season.

Yep thats him. He was involved with Leinster A this season, looks like he is headed North.

Do you think it's possible we've missed out on one here? I've only seen Griffin play twice but he's really impressed both times. It was impressive how he took Hannan to the cleaners in the scrum last weekend.

[Colmodon]

It's possible I'm mixing him up with another player but have heard that a young Clontarf prop will be training with Ulster in pre-season.

Yep thats him. He was involved with Leinster A this season, looks like he is headed North.

Do you think it's possible we've missed out on one here? I've only seen Griffin play twice but he's really impressed both times. It was impressive how he took Hannan to the cleaners in the scrum last weekend.

In fairness to Hanan - Tarf play with pretty much four second rows in their back 5. Nure play with 4 back rows in theirs. That said - Griffin sure looks like he has the build to be a pro level tight head. I don't understand how he's not been on a Dev deal/academy deal somewhere

[Bigdickenergy]

Probably a bit late to the party on this but did anyone else think colm de buitlears comments after the AIL final were total sh!t? Making out like academy players up and down the country were getting smoked by AIL lads. The very odd time maybe and ironically it was the loose head prop on his own team who might have been best described as being “smoked” but going on like there’s a huge pattern of this is totally incorrect imo. Most stand outs in the league were ex pros who came through one of the academies, another irony. Very rare that a player with no academy experience past or present rips up the league and I say that as a regular observer and attendee of club rugby.

[ormond lad]

Probably a bit late to the party on this but did anyone else think colm de buitlears comments after the AIL final were total sh!t? Making out like academy players up and down the country were getting smoked by AIL lads. The very odd time maybe and ironically it was the loose head prop on his own team who might have been best described as being “smoked” but going on like there’s a huge pattern of this is totally incorrect imo. Most stand outs in the league were ex pros who came through one of the academies, another irony. Very rare that a player with no academy experience past or present rips up the league and I say that as a regular observer and attendee of club rugby.

Not at all. He simply said that there is a lot of talent in AIL and that academy players are getting bested in many cases by non pro players.
Not the odd time either. its a fair comment.

[naraic]

Probably a bit late to the party on this but did anyone else think colm de buitlears comments after the AIL final were total sh!t? Making out like academy players up and down the country were getting smoked by AIL lads. The very odd time maybe and ironically it was the loose head prop on his own team who might have been best described as being “smoked” but going on like there’s a huge pattern of this is totally incorrect imo. Most stand outs in the league were ex pros who came through one of the academies, another irony. Very rare that a player with no academy experience past or present rips up the league and I say that as a regular observer and attendee of club rugby.

The AIL has a lot of good players.

Some are ex pro, some are ex academy, some missed out on the academies.

De Buitlear is ex academy himself. Connacht academy to be specific.

Quiet a few ex pros and ex academy players would point to themselves and say I'm better than people in the academy why won't a province pay me money. He could look at himself and compare himself positively to academy centers in various provinces such as Ben Brownlea or Fionn Gibbons or Daniel Hawkshaw or John Devine or Shane Mallon.

The problem is that he has had his 3 years in the academy. He probably has found his level. There's no reason for a province to bet on him. He won't improve to be a starter for a province.

There's an unfortunate physical fact that someone mid to late 20s who has done a good strength and conditioning routine all their lives is going to be stronger and faster than most people in their early 20s even if the early 20s person is in an academy.

Monies paid to academy players aren't because they are the next best thing after the first team players. No! Monies paid to academy talent is a gamble that they will improve and an investment in the future.

The same thing happens everywhere. I was recently discussing the Currie Cup with a South African lad. There's a big desire in some franchises to cut the older players even if they are the better players in the Currie Cup as they won't develop and take up salaries.

[Colmodon]

Probably a bit late to the party on this but did anyone else think colm de buitlears comments after the AIL final were total sh!t? Making out like academy players up and down the country were getting smoked by AIL lads. The very odd time maybe and ironically it was the loose head prop on his own team who might have been best described as being “smoked” but going on like there’s a huge pattern of this is totally incorrect imo. Most stand outs in the league were ex pros who came through one of the academies, another irony. Very rare that a player with no academy experience past or present rips up the league and I say that as a regular observer and attendee of club rugby.

Not at all. He simply said that there is a lot of talent in AIL and that academy players are getting bested in many cases by non pro players.
Not the odd time either. its a fair comment.

I'd agree. Not to say this is your view BDE as you say you are a regular observer and attendee of club rugby but I can say that I have experienced on a number of occasions guys who are new to attending the meeting the club game coming out and thinking the young tyro from U20s or fringe pro players will always be a long way better than the median standard in the league and rarely enough is that borne out in practice. I remember Jack O'Donoghue togging out for UCC in Lakelands and he was clearly better than any other player on the pitch (including putting in a deft grubber for a UCC try) but that is very much the exception not the rule. The guys CDB singled out - Craig Adams, Adam La Grue, Caolán Dooley are young guys who may have been in and around a provincial squad at some level but never in an academy and many would feel that once you miss that academy spot your chance at the pros is gone altogether. Boomer who came off the bench and scored one and made another is another guy who I just don't believe is not better than some players in provincial academies/3rd or 4th on provincial depth charts. The reality is that it is unlikely any of these guys will go from AIL to being a Heineken Cup regular/international player, but I think CDB's point was that some guys show up week in week out in the AIL often directly opposite academy/pro players and perform better than them. That's without the privilege of a pro team S&C regime and while trying to balance work commitments. If guys can get an edge doing that - you'd imagine there's a good chance they could go to another level in a pro regime.

Ben Griffin looks to have the physical profile to play pro ball at tight head - I hope he gets a chance. JJ O'Dea for Tarf, Boomer for Terenure are both better than some of the guys lower down the depth chart in Connacht/Ulster's back row stocks - I would love to see them get the chance. Obviously too late at this stage for Tony Ryan, who togged out for Leinster during the 2015 world cup, but he's another example of a guy plying his trade in AIL, not involved in a pro set up, who could absolutely have been a pro player if given the chance. There are plenty of them throughout the league - I guess CDB's point is that we shouldn't close the door on guys just because at one point in time they weren't deemed good enough for a provincial academy intake.

[Theleafysuburb]

Dan barron of Trinity is currently in 20s camp in prep for World Cup. Deserved.

[FtD]

Dan barron of Trinity is currently in 20s camp in prep for World Cup. Deserved.

Is he Lee Barron's brother?

[Bigdickenergy]

Probably a bit late to the party on this but did anyone else think colm de buitlears comments after the AIL final were total sh!t? Making out like academy players up and down the country were getting smoked by AIL lads. The very odd time maybe and ironically it was the loose head prop on his own team who might have been best described as being “smoked” but going on like there’s a huge pattern of this is totally incorrect imo. Most stand outs in the league were ex pros who came through one of the academies, another irony. Very rare that a player with no academy experience past or present rips up the league and I say that as a regular observer and attendee of club rugby.

Not at all. He simply said that there is a lot of talent in AIL and that academy players are getting bested in many cases by non pro players.
Not the odd time either. its a fair comment.

I'd agree. Not to say this is your view BDE as you say you are a regular observer and attendee of club rugby but I can say that I have experienced on a number of occasions guys who are new to attending the meeting the club game coming out and thinking the young tyro from U20s or fringe pro players will always be a long way better than the median standard in the league and rarely enough is that borne out in practice. I remember Jack O'Donoghue togging out for UCC in Lakelands and he was clearly better than any other player on the pitch (including putting in a deft grubber for a UCC try) but that is very much the exception not the rule. The guys CDB singled out - Craig Adams, Adam La Grue, Caolán Dooley are young guys who may have been in and around a provincial squad at some level but never in an academy and many would feel that once you miss that academy spot your chance at the pros is gone altogether. Boomer who came off the bench and scored one and made another is another guy who I just don't believe is not better than some players in provincial academies/3rd or 4th on provincial depth charts. The reality is that it is unlikely any of these guys will go from AIL to being a Heineken Cup regular/international player, but I think CDB's point was that some guys show up week in week out in the AIL often directly opposite academy/pro players and perform better than them. That's without the privilege of a pro team S&C regime and while trying to balance work commitments. If guys can get an edge doing that - you'd imagine there's a good chance they could go to another level in a pro regime.

Ben Griffin looks to have the physical profile to play pro ball at tight head - I hope he gets a chance. JJ O'Dea for Tarf, Boomer for Terenure are both better than some of the guys lower down the depth chart in Connacht/Ulster's back row stocks - I would love to see them get the chance. Obviously too late at this stage for Tony Ryan, who togged out for Leinster during the 2015 world cup, but he's another example of a guy plying his trade in AIL, not involved in a pro set up, who could absolutely have been a pro player if given the chance. There are plenty of them throughout the league - I guess CDB's point is that we shouldn't close the door on guys just because at one point in time they weren't deemed good enough for a provincial academy intake.

Late replying to this but from having watched a lot of AIL over the past few years, the only names you mentioned here that really impressed me were Dooley and Boomer and I’m nearly sure Boomer was in the Ulster academy or at least got caps in the B and I cup a few years ago. Adams I don’t rate and LaGrue would get annihilated physically at pro level.

[Purist98]

Dan barron of Trinity is currently in 20s camp in prep for World Cup. Deserved.

Is he Lee Barron's brother?

Cousin

[Keith]

Probably a bit late to the party on this but did anyone else think colm de buitlears comments after the AIL final were total sh!t? Making out like academy players up and down the country were getting smoked by AIL lads. The very odd time maybe and ironically it was the loose head prop on his own team who might have been best described as being “smoked” but going on like there’s a huge pattern of this is totally incorrect imo. Most stand outs in the league were ex pros who came through one of the academies, another irony. Very rare that a player with no academy experience past or present rips up the league and I say that as a regular observer and attendee of club rugby.

Not at all. He simply said that there is a lot of talent in AIL and that academy players are getting bested in many cases by non pro players.
Not the odd time either. its a fair comment.

I'd agree. Not to say this is your view BDE as you say you are a regular observer and attendee of club rugby but I can say that I have experienced on a number of occasions guys who are new to attending the meeting the club game coming out and thinking the young tyro from U20s or fringe pro players will always be a long way better than the median standard in the league and rarely enough is that borne out in practice. I remember Jack O'Donoghue togging out for UCC in Lakelands and he was clearly better than any other player on the pitch (including putting in a deft grubber for a UCC try) but that is very much the exception not the rule. The guys CDB singled out - Craig Adams, Adam La Grue, Caolán Dooley are young guys who may have been in and around a provincial squad at some level but never in an academy and many would feel that once you miss that academy spot your chance at the pros is gone altogether. Boomer who came off the bench and scored one and made another is another guy who I just don't believe is not better than some players in provincial academies/3rd or 4th on provincial depth charts. The reality is that it is unlikely any of these guys will go from AIL to being a Heineken Cup regular/international player, but I think CDB's point was that some guys show up week in week out in the AIL often directly opposite academy/pro players and perform better than them. That's without the privilege of a pro team S&C regime and while trying to balance work commitments. If guys can get an edge doing that - you'd imagine there's a good chance they could go to another level in a pro regime.

Ben Griffin looks to have the physical profile to play pro ball at tight head - I hope he gets a chance. JJ O'Dea for Tarf, Boomer for Terenure are both better than some of the guys lower down the depth chart in Connacht/Ulster's back row stocks - I would love to see them get the chance. Obviously too late at this stage for Tony Ryan, who togged out for Leinster during the 2015 world cup, but he's another example of a guy plying his trade in AIL, not involved in a pro set up, who could absolutely have been a pro player if given the chance. There are plenty of them throughout the league - I guess CDB's point is that we shouldn't close the door on guys just because at one point in time they weren't deemed good enough for a provincial academy intake.

You have to remember that a lot of AIL players are actually offered full time contracts abroad, but they refuse them for various reasons. I know one of the Nure players who was offered contracts in England, France and the USA at various points in his career, but the lads are well looked after here.

[Observingprop123]

LEINSTER U19s Squad For Summer Programme:
Aaron O’Brien – St Mary’s College
Adam Watchorn – Kilkenny College
Alan Spicer – Belvedere College SJ
Alex Mullan – Blackrock College
Alex Usanov – Belvedere College SJ
Andre Ryan – Clontarf FC
Andrew Cosgrave – St Michael’s College
Andrew Doyle – Athy RFC
Billy Bohan – Newbridge RFC
Billy Corrigan – Presentation College Bray
Caspar Gabriel – Terenure College
Ciaran Mangan – Naas RFC
Connor Fahy – Wexford Wanderers RFC
David Lucey – St Michael’s College
David Walsh – St Michael’s College
Dylan Kelly – Portlaoise RFC
Evan Moynihan – St Mary’s College
Fionn Hickey – Tullow RFC
Jack Angulo – Blackrock College
Jack Boyan – Mullingar RFC
James Sherwin – St Michael’s College
James Wyse – Navan RFC
Jim White – St Michael’s College
Kieran Hunter – Wicklow RFC
Mahon Ronan – Boyne RFC
Maitiu O’Neill – Belvedere College SJ
Mikey Yarr – Blackrock College
Niall Smyth – Blackrock College
Paddy Bramley – Wexford Wanderers RFC
Paddy Taylor – Newbridge College
Paidi Farrell – Tullamore RFC
Ruari Munnelly – Clane RFC
Samuel Wisniewski – Castleknock College
Tadg Duff – Boyne RFC
Tadhg Ronan – County Carlow FC
Todd Lawlor – Naas RFC
Tom Brophy – Gonzaga College
Tom Chadwick – Seapoint RC
Tom Murtagh – Clongowes Wood College
Tom Stewart – St Michael’s College
Tommy Butler – Blackrock College
Zack Hopkins – St Mary’s College

[OneLungDavy]

LEINSTER U19s Squad For Summer Programme:
Aaron O’Brien – St Mary’s College
Adam Watchorn – Kilkenny College
Alan Spicer – Belvedere College SJ
Alex Mullan – Blackrock College
Alex Usanov – Belvedere College SJ
Andre Ryan – Clontarf FC
Andrew Cosgrave – St Michael’s College
Andrew Doyle – Athy RFC
Billy Bohan – Newbridge RFC
Billy Corrigan – Presentation College Bray
Caspar Gabriel – Terenure College
Ciaran Mangan – Naas RFC
Connor Fahy – Wexford Wanderers RFC
David Lucey – St Michael’s College
David Walsh – St Michael’s College
Dylan Kelly – Portlaoise RFC
Evan Moynihan – St Mary’s College
Fionn Hickey – Tullow RFC
Jack Angulo – Blackrock College
Jack Boyan – Mullingar RFC
James Sherwin – St Michael’s College
James Wyse – Navan RFC
Jim White – St Michael’s College
Kieran Hunter – Wicklow RFC
Mahon Ronan – Boyne RFC
Maitiu O’Neill – Belvedere College SJ
Mikey Yarr – Blackrock College
Niall Smyth – Blackrock College
Paddy Bramley – Wexford Wanderers RFC
Paddy Taylor – Newbridge College
Paidi Farrell – Tullamore RFC
Ruari Munnelly – Clane RFC
Samuel Wisniewski – Castleknock College
Tadg Duff – Boyne RFC
Tadhg Ronan – County Carlow FC
Todd Lawlor – Naas RFC
Tom Brophy – Gonzaga College
Tom Chadwick – Seapoint RC
Tom Murtagh – Clongowes Wood College
Tom Stewart – St Michael’s College
Tommy Butler – Blackrock College
Zack Hopkins – St Mary’s College

Alan Spicer
Alan Spicer
Alan Spicer

[cormac]

George Hadden has signed an academy deal with Munster

[ronk]

Good luck to him. It was tight with 8 players already entering the Leinster Academy.

Munster are both lighter at loosehead (we were able to release Hannan) and have an easier path into the academy.