United Rugby Championship

[Keith]

I too can appreciate that beating teams easily can become unattractive, but we aren't even selling out for group games in Europe. It's been very easy to get tickets for HC games for years, in the RDS and it will only get easier as the group games get more irrelevant with each format change.

I don't know about that.

Last year, the Montpellier game had a restricted attendance, so we don't know what crowd would have turned up and the Lansdowne Road game was against probably the second worst team in Europe so not much of a draw.

The years pre-Covid I remember the RDS being pretty much full for the group games. Certainly Toulouse in 2019 was a sell out.

I don't remember sell outs and if they were, they were selling out very close or on the day itself. If you want to go to a HC game you can easily get tickets and you can usual decide on the day if you want to go. When a team is selling out regularly it creates an extra buzz and actually increases demand for tickets due to FOMO.

[Oldschoolsocks]

I just think it’s a pig of a place to get to tbh

[Xanthippe]

For league games, I don't think we've had 15k+ for a non interpro for years.

Here are all our (non provincial) Pro12 and Pro14 games with over 15k in attendance for the past 10 seasons

Date		Opposition	Result		Attendance
08/09/2012	Dragons		45-25	W	15,724
22/09/2012	Edinburgh	22-16	W	17,794
27/10/2012	Blues		59-22	W	17,236
01/12/2012	Zebre		37-7	W	15,894
16/02/2013	Treviso		40-5	W	16,208
23/02/2013	Scarlets	32-5	W	15,627
23/03/2013	Glasgow		22-17	W	16,156
03/05/2013	Ospreys		37-19	W	17,583
14/09/2013	Ospreys		29-29	D	16,885
27/09/2013	Blues		34-20	W	17,180
30/11/2013	Scarlets	36-19	W	15,740
14/02/2014	Dragons		31-19	W	15,000
18/04/2014	Treviso		62-7	W	17,200
10/05/2014	Edinburgh	15-13	W	17,900
31/05/2014	Glasgow		34-12	W	19,200
13/09/2014	Scarlets	42-12	W	16,108
31/10/2014	Edinburgh	33-8	W	15,077
29/11/2014	Ospreys		18-12	W	15,928
15/02/2015	Dragons		14-16	L	15,020
27/03/2015	Glasgow		34-34	D	16,210
19/05/2017	Scarlets	15-27	L	15,861
25/01/2019	Scarlets	22-17	W	15,007

[Serb]

Two in the last 7 years? Wow, I know Covid took two of those years away, but still. We really were at peak support right after our third European crown

[wixfjord]

Two in the last 7 years? Wow, I know Covid took two of those years away, but still. We really were at peak support right after our third European crown

And one of those was a knockout game.

So since 2015 we've had one 15k+ crowd (15,007 at that) for a regular season non interpro game. I know they're far harder to attract fans to, but that ain't great.

The data is there, on a pro rata basis we just aren't that well supported outside the big occasions and we've failed to consistently engage those on the edge of our fanbase.

[Keith]

For league games, I don't think we've had 15k+ for a non interpro for years.

Here are all our (non provincial) Pro12 and Pro14 games with over 15k in attendance for the past 10 seasons

Date		Opposition	Result		Attendance
08/09/2012	Dragons		45-25	W	15,724
22/09/2012	Edinburgh	22-16	W	17,794
27/10/2012	Blues		59-22	W	17,236
01/12/2012	Zebre		37-7	W	15,894
16/02/2013	Treviso		40-5	W	16,208
23/02/2013	Scarlets	32-5	W	15,627
23/03/2013	Glasgow		22-17	W	16,156
03/05/2013	Ospreys		37-19	W	17,583
14/09/2013	Ospreys		29-29	D	16,885
27/09/2013	Blues		34-20	W	17,180
30/11/2013	Scarlets	36-19	W	15,740
14/02/2014	Dragons		31-19	W	15,000
18/04/2014	Treviso		62-7	W	17,200
10/05/2014	Edinburgh	15-13	W	17,900
31/05/2014	Glasgow		34-12	W	19,200
13/09/2014	Scarlets	42-12	W	16,108
31/10/2014	Edinburgh	33-8	W	15,077
29/11/2014	Ospreys		18-12	W	15,928
15/02/2015	Dragons		14-16	L	15,020
27/03/2015	Glasgow		34-34	D	16,210
19/05/2017	Scarlets	15-27	L	15,861
25/01/2019	Scarlets	22-17	W	15,007

Great digging and confirms with what we've been saying. I think our real non interpro and euro average attendance is somewhere around 10-12k, which is around on par with Bayonne in D2
https://www.reddit.com/r/rugbyunion/com ... ce_202122/

Not good enough.

[cormac]

I don't have any definitive evidence of this but I'm utterly convinced that the attendances up to and including the 2014/15 season were based on tickets sold (and thus including all season ticket holders) while since then it's based on who's actually showed up. It's only since 2015/16 where we've had attendances below the total number of season ticket holders.

There were more than a few games before that season where the attendance announced seemed to bare little relation to the numbers actually there.

[wixfjord]

I don't have any definitive evidence of this but I'm utterly convinced that the attendances up to and including the 2014/15 season were based on tickets sold (and thus including all season ticket holders) while since then it's based on who's actually showed up. It's only since 2015/16 where we've had attendances below the total number of season ticket holders.

There were more than a few games before that season where the attendance announced seemed to bare little relation to the numbers actually there.

I believe that's correct.

But I don't think it's that relevant.

For me the issue here isn't necessarily a downwards trendline in crowds since 2015, it's the lack of any discernible upwards trend line in a decade of success.

I really hope a renovated RDS with proper facilities is coming.

[Laighin Break]

Two in the last 7 years? Wow, I know Covid took two of those years away, but still. We really were at peak support right after our third European crown

And one of those was a knockout game.

So since 2015 we've had one 15k+ crowd (15,007 at that) for a regular season non interpro game. I know they're far harder to attract fans to, but that ain't great.

The data is there, on a pro rata basis we just aren't that well supported outside the big occasions and we've failed to consistently engage those on the edge of our fanbase.

Can we blame Matt O'Connor?

[hugonaut]

I really hope a renovated RDS with proper facilities is coming.

I don't think it is going to happen in the near future. This article sounds positive [source: [source: https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/ ... -1.4697462 ] but I would be much more pessimistic.

The cost of construction in Ireland at the moment is incredibly high. Construction inflation was 6% in the second half of 2021, 7.5% in the first half of this year, i.e. 13.5% in a 12 month period. The original cost estimate in 2016 was approx €26m, in October 2021 it was approx €50m, + 13.5 % since then, now potentially €56m+ if delivered on budget, so more like €60m by completion ... that's a f*cking insane increase in six years.

[Morf]

Is there anything to be said for attaching an apartment building to it a la Coventry stadium?

[ronk]

I really hope a renovated RDS with proper facilities is coming.

I don't think it is going to happen in the near future. This article sounds positive [source: [source: https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/ ... -1.4697462 ] but I would be much more pessimistic.

The cost of construction in Ireland at the moment is incredibly high. Construction inflation was 6% in the second half of 2021, 7.5% in the first half of this year, i.e. 13.5% in a 12 month period. The original cost estimate in 2016 was approx €26m, in October 2021 it was approx €50m, + 13.5 % since then, now potentially €56m+ if delivered on budget, so more like €60m by completion ... that's a f*cking insane increase in six years.

14% because it's compound.

It's a tough one, I'm not sure to what extent it would change much. Most fans would have the same experience. There's be some latent demand but it would need good marketing and administration to get there.

Leinster are a little bit stuck in that Aviva is so close and suitable. It's great for aggregate revenue but it cannibalises attendances from URC fixtures and makes it feasible to drop season tickets. All the more so with season tickets having lost their economic advantage.

This year there were 8 knockout games not on the season ticket and only 6 home URC non derbies. 11 games total on the season ticket and 3 were in Aviva. 8 in the RDS.

A season ticket isn't really a season ticket, it's not fit for purpose. And it probably needs a bit of innovation rather than an it ain't broke so don't fix it approach.

Because of the cost of knockout and Aviva games it's likely that those games are more than the season ticket.

Personally I'd love to see an opt out choice for knockout games. You get a, say, 48 hour window to opt out and then you automatically buy your normal seat in knockout games.

Make it easy for Munster season ticket holders to buy tickets to the Aviva game, even as part of their season ticket.

But some things are really convenient. I bought a ticket on my phone outside the ground for the URC semi because I made a late call on where to sit because of the rain.

[wixfjord]

On the point made a few times above that because we win so much people are less likely to watch, this is worth a read.

A paper published in 2020 by researchers at the University of Liverpool — and drawing on a welter of academic investigation into the motivations of sports fans — found that there was no correlation between how uncertain the outcome of any game was and how many people watched it. The link, they wrote, was “decisively nonsignificant.”

That is not, it turns out, why most people watch sports, whether we want to admit it to ourselves or not. According to the researchers, there was a connection between viewership and the quality of player on show. Even more significant, though, was the name of the teams involved. The power of brand, they wrote, tended to “dominate any contribution to audience size.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/12/spor ... sliga.html

[wixfjord]

I really hope a renovated RDS with proper facilities is coming.

I don't think it is going to happen in the near future. This article sounds positive [source: [source: https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/ ... -1.4697462 ] but I would be much more pessimistic.

The cost of construction in Ireland at the moment is incredibly high. Construction inflation was 6% in the second half of 2021, 7.5% in the first half of this year, i.e. 13.5% in a 12 month period. The original cost estimate in 2016 was approx €26m, in October 2021 it was approx €50m, + 13.5 % since then, now potentially €56m+ if delivered on budget, so more like €60m by completion ... that's a f*cking insane increase in six years.

14% because it's compound.

It's a tough one, I'm not sure to what extent it would change much. Most fans would have the same experience. There's be some latent demand but it would need good marketing and administration to get there.

But how would most fans have the same experience in a redesigned RDS with better facilities?

We have one stand that's literally crumbling, one stand that's fine but and two ends that are uncovered in a sport played mainly in Autumn/Winter.

That's beside the toilets and lack of corporate facilities.

Comfort is a key part of bringing new fans, and it's not comfortable to bring a family to a game at the moment because the vast majority of available tickets are either in one of the ends or with limited views in the stands.

[munster#1]

Great to see some constructive criticism on this subject.
When compared directly with their closest rivals Leinster have fairly good results in terms of bums on seats.

However, when you take location and population and on field success into consideration, then Leinster are definitely underperforming.

I have long been a believer that Munster should be going into schools in non traditional areas such as parts of Clare, Waterford, Kerry and Tipp and handing out free tickets to URC matches where they would be treated as VIPs for the day, entering through the corporate entrance, escorted by current players and given a match day souvenir.
This small investment could end up increasing long term supporter numbers, and also increases attendance figures for games which would otherwise be close to 50% capacity.

In Leinster a large population within a short commute of the RDS have zero interest in rugby.
You may never convert adults, but you could tap into the next generation of fans.

[Logorrhea]

[*] Our "talisman" rarely plays. This is somewhat true for all provinces, but you see it often: "I'm taking my son to see Leinster and he wants to watch Sexton play, any idea if he'll be involved?". Sexton has started 22 league games in the last 6 years, compared to 47 for Peter O'Mahony. People want to see the stars

This is a big point for me. If they really want to fill the stands, they need to get the first teamers far more involved in the league games.

[paddyor]

URC viewing figures from last season show the TV crowds the SA teams bring and the draw of Munster.

Pretty poor showing for our viewing figures I must say. I've said this before but I really think we are underperforming in terms of bringing in fans (both into stadium and from the sofa/high stool).

Top 10 most watched regular-season games in 2021/22

R3 Ospreys v Cell C Sharks 580,026
R3 Cardiff v Vodacom Bulls 560,886
R2 Munster v DHL Stormers 538,909
R6 Cell C Sharks v Scarlets 531,421
R10 Munster v Ulster 523,707
R4 Munster v Connacht 521,110
R1 Munster v Cell C Sharks 484,267
R5 Ospreys v Munster 480,652
R4 Ulster v Emirates Lions 468,993
R4 Dragons v DHL Stormers 445,471

Top 5 Games from Ireland

R2 Munster v DHL Stormers 538,909
R10 Munster v Ulster 523,707
R4 Munster v Connacht 521,110
R1 Munster v Cell C Sharks 484,267
R4 Ulster v Emirates Lions 468,993

Top 5 Derby Audiences (league-wide)

R10 Munster v Ulster 523,707
R4 Munster v Connacht 521,110
R16 Ulster v Munster 428,709
R15 Munster v Leinster 402,534
R6 Leinster v Ulster 401,603

I'd wager Leinster fans are more likely to watch Munster than vice versa. Like the Conn and Sharks game was on immediately after a leinster game and I remember watching them in the pub after.

[blockhead]

URC CLUB BENETTON have confirmed the mutual termination of Italy international wing Monty Ioane’s contract.

Ioane signed his most recent deal with the Italian side last December and it was due to run until the summer of 2024, with the option of another year.

However, Ioane is no longer a Benetton player after his departure was officially announced following recent speculation that he was close to an exit.

Ioane said that mental health issues have forced him to stop playing and he needs to be back in Australia – where he was born and grew up – with his family.

The Italian Rugby Federation said it will stay in regular contact with Ioane and he will be considered for international selection in the 2022/23 season.

It’s understood that Ioane will now play his club rugby in Australia.

Pity, damn fine player.

[D4surfer]

The United Rugby Championship is proud to announce that BKT, one of the world’s largest manufacturers of tires for agricultural, industrial and construction machines, has become the league’s northern-hemisphere title sponsor until 2025.

https://www.unitedrugby.com/latest/news ... le-sponsor

I can't see myself rushing out to buy a tractor tire just because they're sponsoring the league.

[Dave Cahill]

I, for one, welcome our new Indian overlords