Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Blueberry »

I know the Connacht game wobbled us all a bit but really in the end it was a very comfortable 4-0 try victory tonight. Scoreline flattered Ulster who did a vanishing trick in the second half.

Normal service resumed.

Now back to talking about how sh1te the league is, how good we are and why Irish rugby is just really Leinster Rugby.......

:) :)

Enjoyed that !!

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Peg Leg »

Jcahill1 wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 4:38 pm
Lads I haven't weighed in on this yet because I still kind of think it's a joke, but why is Ross starting at 13? It's such an incredibly weird decision, can anyone fathom some logic behind it?
I was in this boat, but he was tidy enough when he was shallow enough to be in frame. Tidy break, deft kicks and solid in defence. He is a player who never gives less than everything.
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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Jcahill1 »

Peg Leg wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 10:38 pm
Jcahill1 wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 4:38 pm
Lads I haven't weighed in on this yet because I still kind of think it's a joke, but why is Ross starting at 13? It's such an incredibly weird decision, can anyone fathom some logic behind it?
I was in this boat, but he was tidy enough when he was shallow enough to be in frame. Tidy break, deft kicks and solid in defence. He is a player who never gives less than everything.
Amen, call it a miracle as I would never have believed a slow 10 could make it as a 13! Very happy to be wrong though as he played very well.

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Dundalk 1 »

Jcahill1 wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 10:44 pm
Peg Leg wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 10:38 pm
Jcahill1 wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 4:38 pm
Lads I haven't weighed in on this yet because I still kind of think it's a joke, but why is Ross starting at 13? It's such an incredibly weird decision, can anyone fathom some logic behind it?
I was in this boat, but he was tidy enough when he was shallow enough to be in frame. Tidy break, deft kicks and solid in defence. He is a player who never gives less than everything.
Amen, call it a miracle as I would never have believed a slow 10 could make it as a 13! Very happy to be wrong though as he played very well.

Ross was excellent tonight but not as a 13
He played 10 and 12 and both very well
Sextons goal kicking was off from the beginning and he should have allowed Ross to start kicking the goals before the 4th try

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by carlow man »

curates_egg wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 9:10 pm
Tracey is the worst of a bad batch of Irish lineout throwers.
Must be so demoralising to lose every lineout.
You must have your eyes closed when kelleher is throwing as hes worse than Tracey. I think Tracey has actually been our most consistent thrower in the last 12 months. I'm sure not that long ago there was a stat saying exactly that.

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Gearzbox2 »

carlow man wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 11:01 pm
curates_egg wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 9:10 pm
Tracey is the worst of a bad batch of Irish lineout throwers.
Must be so demoralising to lose every lineout.
You must have your eyes closed when kelleher is throwing as hes worse than Tracey. I think Tracey has actually been our most consistent thrower in the last 12 months. I'm sure not that long ago there was a stat saying exactly that.
Just on tonight, thought JT was given some bad options in terms of calling and they marked it up well...last week he did their poorly, underthrew a couple at least but tonight not all on him

Cronin our best thrower imo, small bit snappier than JT and far better than Kelleher
That’s just my opinion...are any of them world class throwers, no their not unfortunately

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Peg Leg »

Gearzbox2 wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 11:05 pm
carlow man wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 11:01 pm
curates_egg wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 9:10 pm
Tracey is the worst of a bad batch of Irish lineout throwers.
Must be so demoralising to lose every lineout.
You must have your eyes closed when kelleher is throwing as hes worse than Tracey. I think Tracey has actually been our most consistent thrower in the last 12 months. I'm sure not that long ago there was a stat saying exactly that.
Just on tonight, thought JT was given some bad options in terms of calling and they marked it up well...last week he did their poorly, underthrew a couple at least but tonight not all on him

Cronin our best thrower imo, small bit snappier than JT and far better than Kelleher
That’s just my opinion...are any of them world class throwers, no their not unfortunately
Tidied up when Moloney came on
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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Gearzbox2 »

Enjoyed that!!!!
Proper game and good test for us...
Disjointed in the first half in attack but defended very well and bar a few brainless penalties that game then access we looked ok

Much more urgency and bite in the second half
Amazing how a beautiful kick through from J10 led to our early cronin try...we need to do this more...I said it after last weeks game where we just didn’t kick well or at the right time
Few standouts in the pack Cronin, Ryan, JVDF and Doris

Hugo 15 for Ireland maybe???...Robbie H grew into the game and showed his quality
Ross B has pace I never knew he possessed and it showed he’s a very smart defender...looked good

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by arsebiscuits1 »

Whenever I worry that Josh is going to fall by the wayside and get leapfrogged by all the other 7 options he goes and puts in an enormous shift.

He was good tonight. Left nothing out there and showed some lovely skills.

Him Ruddock and Doris is a hard backrow to overlook at based on the performance

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by hugonaut »

Blueberry wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 10:32 pm
I know the Connacht game wobbled us all a bit but really in the end it was a very comfortable 4-0 try victory tonight. Scoreline flattered Ulster who did a vanishing trick in the second half.

Normal service resumed.

Now back to talking about how sh1te the league is, how good we are and why Irish rugby is just really Leinster Rugby.......

:) :)

Enjoyed that !!
I didn't think it was comfortable!

We went in behind at halftime, we lost the Coetzee sin-bin period 0-6 and even when we were three tries to nil up we were still eminently catchable. 17-9 is not a great lead when you've scored three tries and kept the opposition from crossing your line. You give away a try and is 17-16 and they have the momentum.

On the positive side of things, Hugo Keenan had a massive game for us on both sides of the ball and is turning into a team leader through the strength and reliability of his performances. It was absolutely great to see Jordan Larmour back on the pitch ... I was as guilty as anybody for over-criticising some of his fullback play before he got injured, but I've missed seeing him on the pitch. What balance! He's such an exciting player with ball in hand and all those high-level games he has played in his young career have really pushed him to round out a lot of the other aspects of his game.

Ross did very well in an unfamiliar role. I can't recall him ever starting a game anywhere but No10, and I thought he did himself proud. I think that will give him a lot of confidence, funnily enough. Robbie Henshaw had a good game and is a cracking competitor, which is no secret. DK took his try brilliantly and was, once again, essentially faultless in all he was asked to do.

Ryaner had a very, very busy game up front and set a good physical marker. JVDF didn't hit the heights of his final performance but kept the motor running for the full 80 in a back-and-forth battle with Jordi Murphy, who impressed for Ulster. Cro did exceptionally well, both out of touch and in open play ... it looked like he was slipping down the depth chart but the last couple of games have pushed him right back up. Doris had a couple of moments in the first half and then grew into the game in the second.

James Tracy is such a worker for us but his throwing, which was never a strong suit, is going backwards this season. At it's worst it's a horrible upright ball with too little pace and a bit of wobble. He's got a bit of a tell as well in that he starts with the ball over his head and then c~*ks it back, rather than starting with it in the cocked position.

We should be looking to move Cian to the back end of the game, in my opinion. He has an enormous quantity of miles on the clock now and if we want to maximise his contribution and take care of him, he should be playing the shorter split at loosehead and we should be looking to take the load off him impact-wise. Not what a competitor like him would want to hear, but it's just one man's opinion. He's only recently turned 33 [not ancient for a prop, by any means] but it's not the years, it's the mileage. He's played 330+ pro games of rugby in the front row at this stage.

Similar situation with J10. He had his good break down the left and he was probably victim of a great bit of play with the pénaltouche, but his goal-kicking was poor, he didn't get our backline running smoothly, he wasn't able to dominate the game from outhalf and he wasn't able to turn the ref to our side. He bagged 1/4 placekicks and his input to our four tries was pretty marginal. There's competition for his position, so he needs to start playing better to hold the jersey.

EDIT: You can also see the logic in going with a 6-2 split if you have two outhalves in your starting lineup. We brought Jimmy O'Brien on for the sake of bringing him on in the last minute and left Harry on the bench for the full game.

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by backrower8 »

curates_egg wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 9:42 pm
Laighin Break wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 9:18 pm
Fair play to Brace for penalising McGrath there
Hopefully it (and the emphasis on enforcing that law) will be the kick up the hole McGrath needs. The difference when he came on for JGP was glaring. So good at every aspect of the game apart from the most important one for a 9.
JGP didn't pass well either. We have scrum-halves that can't pass properly and hookers that can't throw. Cronin throws straight but doesn't get the right height enough - so Ulster competed and stole a few.

Also, Ryan was better tonight and I particularly liked his 2 offloads, but he goes to ground far too much and easily in his carries and seems to have limited footwork. A great engine and all all round work-rate but a lot to develop still.

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by backrower8 »

curates_egg wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 10:25 pm

However, I was referring to the tempo he gave and the speed getting the ball away.

McGrath didn’t attempt any difficult passes but took an age at many/most rucks.

The new emphasis is aimed at eliminating the flapping around by 9s like Murray and McGrath.
Strange, I was cursing JGP's hesitancy and cr@p passing several times throughout his tenure. He was great in broken play. Neither scrum-half was good getting the ball away quickly. In fact Shanahan was the only 9 to put real tempo into things when he came on.

I assume playing J10 and RB was to get them both minutes before the Champions Cup next week. Fair play to RB for applying himself well, but it doesn't reflect well on Ulster that he wasn't properly tested.

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Gearzbox2 »

backrower8 wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 11:59 pm
curates_egg wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 9:42 pm
Laighin Break wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 9:18 pm
Fair play to Brace for penalising McGrath there
Hopefully it (and the emphasis on enforcing that law) will be the kick up the hole McGrath needs. The difference when he came on for JGP was glaring. So good at every aspect of the game apart from the most important one for a 9.
JGP didn't pass well either. We have scrum-halves that can't pass properly and hookers that can't throw. Cronin throws straight but doesn't get the right height enough - so Ulster competed and stole a few.

Also, Ryan was better tonight and I particularly liked his 2 offloads, but he goes to ground far too much and easily in his carries and seems to have limited footwork. A great engine and all all round work-rate but a lot to develop still.
Cronin didn’t lose any line outs tonight, didn’t throw high enough??? No idea what that means

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Blueberry »

hugonaut wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 11:30 pm
Blueberry wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 10:32 pm
I know the Connacht game wobbled us all a bit but really in the end it was a very comfortable 4-0 try victory tonight. Scoreline flattered Ulster who did a vanishing trick in the second half.

Normal service resumed.

Now back to talking about how sh1te the league is, how good we are and why Irish rugby is just really Leinster Rugby.......

:) :)

Enjoyed that !!
I didn't think it was comfortable!

We went in behind at halftime, we lost the Coetzee sin-bin period 0-6 and even when we were three tries to nil up we were still eminently catchable. 17-9 is not a great lead when you've scored three tries and kept the opposition from crossing your line. You give away a try and is 17-16 and they have the momentum.

On the positive side of things, Hugo Keenan had a massive game for us on both sides of the ball and is turning into a team leader through the strength and reliability of his performances. It was absolutely great to see Jordan Larmour back on the pitch ... I was as guilty as anybody for over-criticising some of his fullback play before he got injured, but I've missed seeing him on the pitch. What balance! He's such an exciting player with ball in hand and all those high-level games he has played in his young career have really pushed him to round out a lot of the other aspects of his game.

Ross did very well in an unfamiliar role. I can't recall him ever starting a game anywhere but No10, and I thought he did himself proud. I think that will give him a lot of confidence, funnily enough. Robbie Henshaw had a good game and is a cracking competitor, which is no secret. DK took his try brilliantly and was, once again, essentially faultless in all he was asked to do.

Ryaner had a very, very busy game up front and set a good physical marker. JVDF didn't hit the heights of his final performance but kept the motor running for the full 80 in a back-and-forth battle with Jordi Murphy, who impressed for Ulster. Cro did exceptionally well, both out of touch and in open play ... it looked like he was slipping down the depth chart but the last couple of games have pushed him right back up. Doris had a couple of moments in the first half and then grew into the game in the second.

James Tracy is such a worker for us but his throwing, which was never a strong suit, is going backwards this season. At it's worst it's a horrible upright ball with too little pace and a bit of wobble. He's got a bit of a tell as well in that he starts with the ball over his head and then c~*ks it back, rather than starting with it in the cocked position.

We should be looking to move Cian to the back end of the game, in my opinion. He has an enormous quantity of miles on the clock now and if we want to maximise his contribution and take care of him, he should be playing the shorter split at loosehead and we should be looking to take the load off him impact-wise. Not what a competitor like him would want to hear, but it's just one man's opinion. He's only recently turned 33 [not ancient for a prop, by any means] but it's not the years, it's the mileage. He's played 330+ pro games of rugby in the front row at this stage.

Similar situation with J10. He had his good break down the left and he was probably victim of a great bit of play with the pénaltouche, but his goal-kicking was poor, he didn't get our backline running smoothly, he wasn't able to dominate the game from outhalf and he wasn't able to turn the ref to our side. He bagged 1/4 placekicks and his input to our four tries was pretty marginal. There's competition for his position, so he needs to start playing better to hold the jersey.

EDIT: You can also see the logic in going with a 6-2 split if you have two outhalves in your starting lineup. We brought Jimmy O'Brien on for the sake of bringing him on in the last minute and left Harry on the bench for the full game.
Good post but just to be argumentative I am going to say it was pretty comfortable over 80 mins. Ulster were outta that game when we went over for try 3 and really got blown away in the second half. Yes they scrabbled well in the first half, our wobbly lineout slowed our momentum a bit when Tracy came on and Cooney knocked over his kicks and J10 missed a couple. Another day that could have been a 25 point win.

Considering they are on a 10 game streak and I have to say it was pretty good.

Hugo is some find, Ireland Leinster fullback hopefully for many years to come.

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by arsebiscuits1 »

backrower8 wrote:
curates_egg wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 9:42 pm
Laighin Break wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 9:18 pm
Fair play to Brace for penalising McGrath there
Hopefully it (and the emphasis on enforcing that law) will be the kick up the hole McGrath needs. The difference when he came on for JGP was glaring. So good at every aspect of the game apart from the most important one for a 9.
JGP didn't pass well either. We have scrum-halves that can't pass properly and hookers that can't throw. Cronin throws straight but doesn't get the right height enough - so Ulster competed and stole a few.

Also, Ryan was better tonight and I particularly liked his 2 offloads, but he goes to ground far too much and easily in his carries and seems to have limited footwork. A great engine and all all round work-rate but a lot to develop still.
Cronin was 8/8.......




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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Laighin Break »

backrower8 wrote:
January 9th, 2021, 12:09 am
curates_egg wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 10:25 pm

However, I was referring to the tempo he gave and the speed getting the ball away.

McGrath didn’t attempt any difficult passes but took an age at many/most rucks.

The new emphasis is aimed at eliminating the flapping around by 9s like Murray and McGrath.
Strange, I was cursing JGP's hesitancy and cr@p passing several times throughout his tenure. He was great in broken play. Neither scrum-half was good getting the ball away quickly. In fact Shanahan was the only 9 to put real tempo into things when he came on.

I assume playing J10 and RB was to get them both minutes before the Champions Cup next week. Fair play to RB for applying himself well, but it doesn't reflect well on Ulster that he wasn't properly tested.
JGP is great at the long skip passes to the wing when a couple of metres out. His broken play running/sniping and support play was very good yesterday but his passing was a real mixed bag. Sexton had to reach up for a high ball and Henshaw had to readjust a good few times with passes from him.

McGrath on the other hand took way to much out of the ball - he was penalised for not using it within 5 seconds, and on two attacking lineouts that we won when he was on the pitch (which was a rarity), he dummied and went into contact instead of throwing it out for the preplanned backline move. There was one occasion where Toland was getting very excited because Doris was at first receiver but we never got to see how that would pan out.

Leinster's best scrumhalf on display last night was Van Der Flier. Two rocket passes that went right to the tit of the outhalf.

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by backrower8 »

Gearzbox2 wrote:
January 9th, 2021, 12:13 am

Cronin didn’t lose any line outs tonight, didn’t throw high enough??? No idea what that means
It means what it says. Jumpers were receiving balls way below the peak of their reach. This encouraged Ulster to contest more lineouts. We had several very close calls in
those we won.

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by backrower8 »

arsebiscuits1 wrote:
January 9th, 2021, 12:29 am
backrower8 wrote:
curates_egg wrote:
January 8th, 2021, 9:42 pm


Hopefully it (and the emphasis on enforcing that law) will be the kick up the hole McGrath needs. The difference when he came on for JGP was glaring. So good at every aspect of the game apart from the most important one for a 9.
JGP didn't pass well either. We have scrum-halves that can't pass properly and hookers that can't throw. Cronin throws straight but doesn't get the right height enough - so Ulster competed and stole a few.

Also, Ryan was better tonight and I particularly liked his 2 offloads, but he goes to ground far too much and easily in his carries and seems to have limited footwork. A great engine and all all round work-rate but a lot to develop still.
Cronin was 8/8.......

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……only because Ulster didn’t contest all 8. He through a few to 60-70% of the jumper’s reach.

Cronin threw moderately well, which is a maddening thing to say about a pro sports person whose primary specialist skill is to throw really well. The rest of our hookers also lack in this key skill, with possible exception of Sheehan.

Sub-academy hooker Lee Barron has excellent darts, but that’s not relevant now.

Compounding this irritation is that we have a former international hooker and coach as our forwards coach.

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Gearzbox2 »

backrower8 wrote:
January 9th, 2021, 9:14 am
arsebiscuits1 wrote:
January 9th, 2021, 12:29 am
backrower8 wrote:
JGP didn't pass well either. We have scrum-halves that can't pass properly and hookers that can't throw. Cronin throws straight but doesn't get the right height enough - so Ulster competed and stole a few.

Also, Ryan was better tonight and I particularly liked his 2 offloads, but he goes to ground far too much and easily in his carries and seems to have limited footwork. A great engine and all all round work-rate but a lot to develop still.
Cronin was 8/8.......

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……only because Ulster didn’t contest all 8. He through a few to 60-70% of the jumper’s reach.

Cronin threw moderately well, which is a maddening thing to say about a pro sports person whose primary specialist skill is to throw really well. The rest of our hookers also lack in this key skill, with possible exception of Sheehan.

Sub-academy hooker Lee Barron has excellent darts, but that’s not relevant now.

Compounding this irritation is that we have a former international hooker and coach as our forwards coach.
So cronin hits all his men and you still find a flaw
Hilarious...take a break backrower

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Re: Leinster v Ulster Fri 8th January 2021 19:35 EirSport

Post by Blueberry »

Glass half full stuff, 8 from 8 but the only reason he got 8 from 8 was because Ulster didn't contest...... I wonder do the players ever read this forum and go jeepers 'wadda I gotta do to please this crowd' :mrgreen:

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