Tighthead Prop going forward

[mildlyinterested]

Some serious tighthead talent in the underage ranks by the look of things:

U20
Paddy McCarthy(Blackrock/DUFC)
Ronan Foxe(Tullamore RFC/Old Belvedere)
U19
Andrew Sparrow(St. Marys)
Adam Daey(Tullow RFC/Lansdowne)
U18
Alex Mullan(Blackrock)
Riain Coogan(St. Michaels)
Adam Watchorn(Kilkenny)

Alex Mullan and Riain Coogan both very impressive so far in the cup, Adam Watchorn up today and Andrew Sparrow up on Thursday.

[TrapperChamonix]

Some serious tighthead talent in the underage ranks by the look of things:

U20
Paddy McCarthy(Blackrock/DUFC)
Ronan Foxe(Tullamore RFC/Old Belvedere)
U19
Andrew Sparrow(St. Marys)
Adam Daey(Tullow RFC/Lansdowne)
U18
Alex Mullan(Blackrock)
Riain Coogan(St. Michaels)
Adam Watchorn(Kilkenny)

Alex Mullan and Riain Coogan both very impressive so far in the cup, Adam Watchorn up today and Andrew Sparrow up on Thursday.

We should sign John Ryan for 2 years when hes finished in NZ in June. Good for us as he fixes a short term hole we have in the squad and good for him as Munster have shafted him twice so no point looking to them for the future.

[mildlyinterested]

Some serious tighthead talent in the underage ranks by the look of things:

U20
Paddy McCarthy(Blackrock/DUFC)
Ronan Foxe(Tullamore RFC/Old Belvedere)
U19
Andrew Sparrow(St. Marys)
Adam Daey(Tullow RFC/Lansdowne)
U18
Alex Mullan(Blackrock)
Riain Coogan(St. Michaels)
Adam Watchorn(Kilkenny)

Alex Mullan and Riain Coogan both very impressive so far in the cup, Adam Watchorn up today and Andrew Sparrow up on Thursday.

We should sign John Ryan for 2 years when hes finished in NZ in June. Good for us as he fixes a short term hole we have in the squad and good for him as Munster have shafted him twice so no point looking to them for the future.

by all accounts he is returning to Munster after his NZ experience.

[coolbawn]

We should sign John Ryan for 2 years when hes finished in NZ in June. Good for us as he fixes a short term hole we have in the squad and good for him as Munster have shafted him twice so no point looking to them for the future.

by all accounts he is returning to Munster after his NZ experience.

Yes, see https://www.munsterrugby.ie/2023/01/31/ ... contracts/

[CiaranIrl]

Starting to feel a bit worried about Furlong's long suffering calf problems. Hopefully the medical understanding is better than in Flannery's day.

[OneLungDavy]

I can imagine having a dodgy calf would be an absolute nightmare for scrummaging.

[Oldschool]

We should sign John Ryan for 2 years when hes finished in NZ in June. Good for us as he fixes a short term hole we have in the squad and good for him as Munster have shafted him twice so no point looking to them for the future.

by all accounts he is returning to Munster after his NZ experience.

Yes, see https://www.munsterrugby.ie/2023/01/31/ ... contracts/

Would this make John Ryan available for selection for the RWC

[mildlyinterested]

Cian Healy(35/Belvedere/Clontarf)
Michael Ala'alatoa(32)
Tadhg Furlong(30/New Ross RFC/Clontarf)
Vakh Abdaladze(27/Coolmine RFC/Clontarf)
Tom Clarkson(23/Blackrock/DUFC)
--
Temi Lasisi(22/Enniscorthy RFC/Lansdowne)
Rory McGuire(21/Blackrock/UCD)
Paddy McCarthy(20/Blackrock/DUFC)
--
Adam Deay(U20/Tullow RFC/Lansdowne)
Andrew Sparrow(U20/St. Marys)
Alex Mullan(U19/Blackrock)

* Ages as of start of next season

[Serb]

Are we assuming this is Healy's last season? He seems solid enough on the tight head side, maybe bulking up a little and moving over would give him an extra year? I think we need the depth as Furlong never plays and the sentiment isn't exactly overwhelmingly positive for the other options at the moment.

[mildlyinterested]

Are we assuming this is Healy's last season? He seems solid enough on the tight head side, maybe bulking up a little and moving over would give him an extra year? I think we need the depth as Furlong never plays and the sentiment isn't exactly overwhelmingly positive for the other options at the moment.

No, I'd say he will play on next season but that could be it then.

[Observingprop123]

Is tighthead prop a concern going forward now? Furlong doesn't look like he will play much going forward and I don't see anyone coming through in the next 2 seasons. What will we do as big Mike doesn't seem to be good enough at scrum time against the best.

Is there an argument that depowering the scrum at youth levels means we aren't producing large enough props for our system?

[ronk]

Dan Brennan is 132kg loosehead. Does anyone think he'd be the same weight having come through the Irish system? He'd be a good chunk smaller. I don't know whether he'd be a better or worse player.

It's not just scrums, it's not just youths rugby.

As an aside, Brive have been relegated so it's a better time for a move. Healy and Kilcoyne are winding down, McGrath is gone, Boyle is much smaller. There's room for him within the system. But a move like that would have to partly come from Nucifora.

[Keith]

Can we stop this nonsense about signing players to win a HC? We had one of the best squads ever assembled and couldnt win either comp. This is a mentality issue rather than a personal one.

[ronk]

Can we stop this nonsense about signing players to win a HC? We had one of the best squads ever assembled and couldnt win either comp. This is a mentality issue rather than a personal one.

La Rochelle have 5 players in their squad over 135kg. There's an element of physics at work. I think we can win with a smaller squad, I think it's the only way we can win. It's not entirely fair to call it a mentality issue, we've been beaten by high spending teams stocked with elite talent and big, big players. Furlong and Porter are 125kg, mobile and bloody good.

We already sign players. Alaalatoa and Jenkins are the biggest players in their positions for us.

I haven't watched Brennan play this season so I don't know if it's a good idea, but if he is then there's a window for the IRFU to make a move. It probably wouldn't be Leinster, because we don't get IQ talent and we have players there. If it's this year it won't be Ulster because they signed Kitshoff. Munster have depth but that's never stopped them, Connacht might be a better bet.

[Observingprop123]

Dan Brennan is 132kg loosehead. Does anyone think he'd be the same weight having come through the Irish system? He'd be a good chunk smaller. I don't know whether he'd be a better or worse player.

It's not just scrums, it's not just youths rugby.

As an aside, Brive have been relegated so it's a better time for a move. Healy and Kilcoyne are winding down, McGrath is gone, Boyle is much smaller. There's room for him within the system. But a move like that would have to partly come from Nucifora.

You're right about the irish system. In my time I've played against some monsters who usually make it into Leinster teams, but the 1.5 metre rule means that you can easily slot in a slightly larger flanker in the scrum and experience nothing catastrophic.

Good example was Sparrow against Kilkenny last year, folded the loosehead 3 times in a row and got no penalty or reward for it. I know its done for health and safety etc and we want lads good around the park, but relying on Healy to lock out scrums at tighthead if we have a single injury in our first 2 tightheads isn't where we should be.

[FtD]

Andrew Porter spoke on this topic specifically in an interview last week - he mentions that one of the first times he ever met Stuart Lancaster that at the time he was 128kg. Said his first year at U20s he was 113kg and in his second season he was 130kg.

He said Lancaster said to him "If you can do my sessions at that weight then fine, but I think you're going to struggle" - so it's a clear indication that Leinster favour mobility over pure bulk and power. Porter says his optimum weight now is 114kg - 116kg.

[ormond lad]

Dan Brennan is 132kg loosehead. Does anyone think he'd be the same weight having come through the Irish system? He'd be a good chunk smaller. I don't know whether he'd be a better or worse player.

It's not just scrums, it's not just youths rugby.

As an aside, Brive have been relegated so it's a better time for a move. Healy and Kilcoyne are winding down, McGrath is gone, Boyle is much smaller. There's room for him within the system. But a move like that would have to partly come from Nucifora.

You're right about the irish system. In my time I've played against some monsters who usually make it into Leinster teams, but the 1.5 metre rule means that you can easily slot in a slightly larger flanker in the scrum and experience nothing catastrophic.

Good example was Sparrow against Kilkenny last year, folded the loosehead 3 times in a row and got no penalty or reward for it. I know its done for health and safety etc and we want lads good around the park, but relying on Healy to lock out scrums at tighthead if we have a single injury in our first 2 tightheads isn't where we should be.

The 1.5 metre rule is in everywhere so not a factor.
And you dont really see too often larger flankers in the front row from my experience of going to far too many games a year at all levels - youths and schools

[Ruckedtobits]

The prototype LHP & THP players we need are Argentinian, not French or South African. Although Argentina have not won The Championship since it commenced, their scrum is almost always the strongest part of their game, even without front-five forwards who weight +130kg.

McBride has marginally improved our scrum and our maul defence. However, I've long believed that somebody like Ledesma would be a great Coach signing, based on his impact elsewhere.

Maybe Leo has already spoken to Felipe about this, if not maybe he will do before the summer is over.

Personally, I believe that Leinster have a couple of THP prospects who just might emerge in the manner that Tadgh did originally.

[FtD]

The guy I'd love to know more about how his development is going is Rory McGuire. He looks to have good size and was effective for the Irish 20s, but injuries seem to have stalled his development since then. Anyone any sense as to how he's coming along?

[Observingprop123]

Personally, I believe that Leinster have a couple of THP prospects who just might emerge in the manner that Tadgh did originally.

Just to clarify this, do you think they're going to emerge after some experience and turn into fantastic players and do you believe these players are coming up or at the club already?