Leinster - Joe Schmidt's legacy.

[johng]

+1

The only thing I would add is that no one really knows exactly how it all went down. So to get up on a high horse on mere speculation is a bit rich also.

What is the proposed alternative to IRFU control? Independent republic of Leinster and Fcuk everyone else?

Best of luck with that one.

[riocard911]

+1. Have to agree with molloyjh. Also in Joe's favour, since taking off his blue training kit and donning the green jersey he took a very public part in bring the MO'C era to premature close - hurrah!! - and I suspect may even had a hand in Lancaster rocking up at the RDS. Or does anyone seriously believe the famous phone call was a 100% pure Leo initiative with not the slightest input from Joe and his then new buddy Faz? I don't.

[Dave Cahill]

So you're saying Leo is a liar?

[Dave Cahill]

+1

The only thing I would add is that no one really knows exactly how it all went down. So to get up on a high horse on mere speculation is a bit rich also.

What is the proposed alternative to IRFU control? Independent republic of Leinster and Fcuk everyone else?

Best of luck with that one.

On the other hand, "no one really knows exactly how it all went down", so Joe could have told Joey that if he didn't move he wouldn't play international rugby again under his management and Jordi could have been only offered a contract if he went to Ulster. You're simply on an equally high horse of a different colour.

[Peg Leg]

+1

The only thing I would add is that no one really knows exactly how it all went down. So to get up on a high horse on mere speculation is a bit rich also.

What is the proposed alternative to IRFU control? Independent republic of Leinster and Fcuk everyone else?

Best of luck with that one.

On the other hand, "no one really knows exactly how it all went down", so Joe could have told Joey that if he didn't move he wouldn't play international rugby again under his management and Jordi could have been only offered a contract if he went to Ulster. You're simply on an equally high horse of a different colour.

Ah here, did you even read what JG wrote?

[Dave Cahill]

I did. He agreed with some speculation before complaining about speculating.

[artaneboy]

I did. He agreed with some speculation before complaining about speculating.

The difference is John’s speculation is grounded in more likelihood. His and JJ’s overall premise on relationships and necessary hierarchy between Leinster and Ireland is also more sensible.


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[Peg Leg]

I did. He agreed with some speculation before complaining about speculating.

He plus one'd a "great post" comment?
As an aside the word speculating looks revolting.
My own take on the situation is thus, good move for Carbury a selfish one, but wise nevertheless. Joe may have made all the contract threats that he felt necessary or maybe just commented that Ireland isn't looking for a full back in the near future.

[Dave Cahill]

I did. He agreed with some speculation before complaining about speculating.

The difference is John’s speculation is grounded in more likelihood. His and JJ’s overall premise on relationships and necessary hierarchy between Leinster and Ireland is also more sensible.


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Nah, it's just the one you happen to agree with. Other people will think they're "useful idiots", and others will take a little from column A and a little from column B. As John said, none of us actually know what really happened.

What we do know, is that for all that Joe is a genuinely nice and considerate person on a personal level with no 'side' to him, professionally he's a cold hearted b$&%@#d who will leave no stone unturned in doing his job. He wouldn't think twice about forcing players to move provinces if he thought it was in the best interest of the national team, and the idea that he wouldn't do that kind of thing is patently ridiculous - he couldn't care less about how Munster, Leinster, Ulster or Connacht felt about it or think about him - he's not doing it for himself, he's doing it for the team. He couldn't care less what the players think about it either, they aren't going to play international rugby for anyone else after all.

That's okay though - that's the way it's supposed to be, that's his job after all, he's bloody good at it, and the provinces exist to serve the national team.

[LeinsterLeader]

So do we believe Joe when he says he had nothing to do with the Carbery move?

"Ireland coach Joe Schmidt confirmed that Joey Carbery will play his rugby with Munster next season. Speaking before the Ireland team travels to Australia for a three-match tour, Schmidt said he was as “surprised” as anyone at Carbery’s move and that he did not have any hand in persuading the 21-year-old to leave Leinster.

Despite Leinster consistently saying that the player was content and happy living and playing in Dublin, the Ireland coach said that Carbery’s decision was news to him and the move to Munster was his decision alone.

“It’s new news to me,” said Schmidt. “I haven’t had time to digest it personally. It’s a decision Joey has taken a bit of time over. It doesn’t seem to have affected his performances any. I think he’s played very well.

“I understand why Leinster would be desperately keen to hang on to him and why Munster feel that it’s a huge bonus for them.

“That’s a decision he’s made. Apart from him catching up with me, which was nicely photographed, I’ve left him to it. “

The move is designed specifically to allow Carbery to play at outhalf, where Schmidt sees his long-term career with the national team.

But the coach could not say if Carbery’s move was conditional on him playing at 10 rather than fullback, where he played most of his rugby with Leinster this season.

“I have no idea. I have no idea,” added Schmidt at the team’s base in Carton House."

[LeRouxIsPHat]

I love the idea that Joey asked to meet for a coffee basically to give Joe a heads up about the move. "Would you mind if I was playing ten every week?"

[artaneboy]

I did. He agreed with some speculation before complaining about speculating.

The difference is John’s speculation is grounded in more likelihood. His and JJ’s overall premise on relationships and necessary hierarchy between Leinster and Ireland is also more sensible.


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Nah, it's just the one you happen to agree with. Other people will think they're "useful idiots", and others will take a little from column A and a little from column B. As John said, none of us actually know what really happened.

What we do know, is that for all that Joe is a genuinely nice and considerate person on a personal level with no 'side' to him, professionally he's a cold hearted b$&%@#d who will leave no stone unturned in doing his job. He wouldn't think twice about forcing players to move provinces if he thought it was in the best interest of the national team, and the idea that he wouldn't do that kind of thing is patently ridiculous - he couldn't care less about how Munster, Leinster, Ulster or Connacht felt about it or think about him - he's not doing it for himself, he's doing it for the team. He couldn't care less what the players think about it either, they aren't going to play international rugby for anyone else after all.

That's okay though - that's the way it's supposed to be, that's his job after all, he's bloody good at it, and the provinces exist to serve the national team.

Okay- so we basically agree then. He good at his job and is straight and honourable in doing it.


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[ronk]

Does anyone think a move like Carbery would have been allowed without consulting Joe/knowing where he stood? He was surprised how it unfolded.

[molloyjh]

Nah, it's just the one you happen to agree with. Other people will think they're "useful idiots", and others will take a little from column A and a little from column B. As John said, none of us actually know what really happened.

What we do know, is that for all that Joe is a genuinely nice and considerate person on a personal level with no 'side' to him, professionally he's a cold hearted b$&%@#d who will leave no stone unturned in doing his job. He wouldn't think twice about forcing players to move provinces if he thought it was in the best interest of the national team, and the idea that he wouldn't do that kind of thing is patently ridiculous - he couldn't care less about how Munster, Leinster, Ulster or Connacht felt about it or think about him - he's not doing it for himself, he's doing it for the team. He couldn't care less what the players think about it either, they aren't going to play international rugby for anyone else after all.

That's okay though - that's the way it's supposed to be, that's his job after all, he's bloody good at it, and the provinces exist to serve the national team.

I'd like to think that there's a bit more smarts to how Joe operates. Managing players by forcing them to do things they don't want to do is very short sighted and damaging. Building a case, making that case and allowing them to realise the benefits themselves is a far more astute way of going about things. If you can sell an idea to a player rather than force his hand everyone will be better for it.

Now I've obviously no idea if that is how Joe operates or not, but he's a smart guy and IMO it'd be incredibly dumb to be that dictatorial about these things. So I'd be far more inclined to believe he isn't that dictatorial.

[mildlyinterested]

So do we believe Joe when he says he had nothing to do with the Carbery move?

[Lar]

It is pretty clear that Joe is duplicitous in pretty well everything he does. Everything is done to serve an end and whatever comes out of the mouth is just dressing. I base this hypothesis on the empirical fact that every second sentence starts with the word "Yo", which is clearly a contrivance of 'yes' and 'no'. If he is ever asked whether he agreed with a statement he can pick and choose whether he did or didn't...

[Oldschool]

It is pretty clear that Joe is duplicitous in pretty well everything he does. Everything is done to serve an end and whatever comes out of the mouth is just dressing. I base this hypothesis on the empirical fact that every second sentence starts with the word "Yo", which is clearly a contrivance of 'yes' and 'no'. If he is ever asked whether he agreed with a statement he can pick and choose whether he did or didn't...

Yo approximates to +1 or -1 or maybe Square Root(+1) or Square Root(-1).
It's a bit complex maybe but then Joe is a very complex individual, he'd have to be to get Ireland to be as good as they are.

[riocard911]

On the announcement today of his retirement from coaching, here's wishing Joe Schmidt all the best and go raibh míle, míle maith agat for everything - in blue and green!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[captain pugwash]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/super- ... 35LFFCAJI/

[LeinsterLeader]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/super- ... 35LFFCAJI/

We shouldn't be surprised. He always was a true blue!

Could never see him going to the Reds