Robbie Henshaw - Best IQ signing?

[Flash Gordon]

He's been good signing. We haven't signed many really high impact IQ players direct from other provinces. Mike McCarthy was an international.

In terms of improving players around him, I'm sure he's done it but he was injured at the start of the season so it can't all be him when t was happening already.

Cronin? One of our all time leading try scorers.

[Serb]

Cronin was great, but I don’t think he would be our best ever irish qualified signing. He was often the bench impact rather than a nailed on first choice pick.

His try scoring record is obviously good, but that played into his greatest strength; exceptional pace for a front row forward.

Hookers also score a lot of tries for Leinster in general — Cronin averaged a try every 4.5 games, Kelleher actually has a better strike rate right now with one on 2.7 games, as does Sheehan with a pretty exceptional one in 1.8 games.

Obviously Cronin delivered his try scoring feats consistently over a much greater period of time, but I don’t think his try scoring record alone really sets him apart.

[Twist]

Henshaw has now beaten all five of NZ, SA, AUS, FRA & ENG starting at both No12 and No13. Phenomenal achievement.

New Zealand
@ No12 [05.11.16]
@ No13 [15.06.22]

South Africa
@ No12 [08.11.14]
@ No13 [11.06.16]

Australia
@ No12 [16.06.18]
@ No13 [22.11.14]

England
@ No12 [01.03.15]
@ No13 [20.03.21]

France
@ No12 [14.02.15]
@ No13 [03.02.18]

This kind of hihg-level stattery is why you were accepted into the space programme

[Flash Gordon]

Cronin was great, but I don’t think he would be our best ever irish qualified signing. He was often the bench impact rather than a nailed on first choice pick.

His try scoring record is obviously good, but that played into his greatest strength; exceptional pace for a front row forward.

Hookers also score a lot of tries for Leinster in general — Cronin averaged a try every 4.5 games, Kelleher actually has a better strike rate right now with one on 2.7 games, as does Sheehan with a pretty exceptional one in 1.8 games.

Obviously Cronin delivered his try scoring feats consistently over a much greater period of time, but I don’t think his try scoring record alone really sets him apart.

He started more than 80% of European games and his scoring rate was higher than Keith Wood who is one of Ireland's greatest every players. He's 2x Champions Cup winner, Challenge Cup winner, 6x league titles, 72 Irish caps and three 6 nations.


No questioning Kelleher and Sheahan's abilities of course, they could both go on to be Irish greats but they will have had some career if they can match his silverware haul. His freakish try scoring record wasn't the only component of his game that was exceptional either as we all know.

[Serb]

I'm guessing you're a Sean Cronin fan.

I don't think anyone is going to agree with you that he's our best IQ signing.

[Oldschoolsocks]

I'm guessing you're a Sean Cronin fan.

I don't think anyone is going to agree with you that he's our best IQ signing.

dunno, depends on what you measure right?

I think Henshaw is a world class player, and a class above Cronin. But does he have the strike rate or number of caps.

[Flash Gordon]

I'm guessing you're a Sean Cronin fan.

I don't think anyone is going to agree with you that he's our best IQ signing.

dunno, depends on what you measure right?

I think Henshaw is a world class player, and a class above Cronin. But does he have the strike rate or number of caps.

Henshaw has clearly done it at a higher level for Ireland and the Lions, though I think Cronin was unlucky to be playing behind the Ireland captain. Robbie will have to triple his try count to get ahead of him and I'm not sure Cronin's was entirely defined by his try scoring record. He was a good scrummager, good over the ball and a great tackler. He had a rep for Ireland for having a line out issue (ironic behind Best) but for Leinster that wasn't generally an issue - helps when you have Dev in the line out of course, I remember his last Ireland start vs Italy in Rome, Quinn Roux was calling the line out as Dev wasn't playing and Roux made a mess of it.

Robbie is phenomenal player, no disputing that and given the criticality of the position and the gaps we had Mike Ross and Eoin Reddan are also in the frame.

[TMC]

Showing my age - Wardie

https://www.rte.ie/archives/2018/0110/9 ... by-opnion/

[Flash Gordon]

Showing my age - Wardie

https://www.rte.ie/archives/2018/0110/9 ... by-opnion/

Think he was only with us for a year or two in the 80's. Think he had a soccer career going too with Rovers and Limerick. Some athlete. How he only got 19 caps is incredible.

[cormac]

Showing my age - Wardie

https://www.rte.ie/archives/2018/0110/9 ... by-opnion/

Tony Ward is from Leinster though.

[Oldschoolsocks]

Tony Ward was the rugby equivalent of Liam Brady, undoubted skill and flair with a talent that shone like a thousand suns.

However like Brady, I always felt he was a bit of a passenger letting the other lads do the hard work.

He turned out to be just as good a commentator as Brady too, so there’s that…

Give me Ollie or Deano any day

[the spoofer]

Tony Ward was the rugby equivalent of Liam Brady, undoubted skill and flair with a talent that shone like a thousand suns.

However like Brady, I always felt he was a bit of a passenger letting the other lads do the hard work.

He turned out to be just as good a commentator as Brady too, so there’s that…

Give me Ollie or Deano any day

Wasn't Deano really a centre who converted to 10? Fabulous player but his kicking skills didn't match those magical hands.

[Flash Gordon]

Tony Ward was the rugby equivalent of Liam Brady, undoubted skill and flair with a talent that shone like a thousand suns.

However like Brady, I always felt he was a bit of a passenger letting the other lads do the hard work.

He turned out to be just as good a commentator as Brady too, so there’s that…

Give me Ollie or Deano any day

Ah hear, Liam Brady was Ireland's greatest ever attacking midfielder. He had unprecidented success in England and Italy, he was far a from a passenger. Wardy worked hard, he was a flair player and had a profile in the media because he was good looking and had an opinion - and he played soccer. None of this went down well with the blazers.

He was also up against Campbell and Dean of course.

Without getting into Leinster's great ever outhalf (there's a conversation!), Wardy didn't play that much for us so woulkdn't make the cut on best IQ signing and as someone else said, Ward was born and went to school in Dublin.

[Flash Gordon]

Tony Ward was the rugby equivalent of Liam Brady, undoubted skill and flair with a talent that shone like a thousand suns.

However like Brady, I always felt he was a bit of a passenger letting the other lads do the hard work.

He turned out to be just as good a commentator as Brady too, so there’s that…

Give me Ollie or Deano any day

Wasn't Deano really a centre who converted to 10? Fabulous player but his kicking skills didn't match those magical hands.

Yeah, he didn't place kick for Ireland. He was a super player, Ciaran Frawley reminds me a lot of Deano, the effortless glide across the pitch, the distribution but Frawley has the boot in his armoury too!

[Barry]

Tony Ward was the rugby equivalent of Liam Brady, undoubted skill and flair with a talent that shone like a thousand suns.

However like Brady, I always felt he was a bit of a passenger letting the other lads do the hard work.

He turned out to be just as good a commentator as Brady too, so there’s that…

Give me Ollie or Deano any day

Wasn't Deano really a centre who converted to 10? Fabulous player but his kicking skills didn't match those magical hands.

Other way around. Played 10 for St Mary's and the Irish schools. Was moved to 12 as Campbell had the 10 Jersey sown up

Sent from my VOG-L09 using Tapatalk

[Oldschoolsocks]

Tony Ward was the rugby equivalent of Liam Brady, undoubted skill and flair with a talent that shone like a thousand suns.

However like Brady, I always felt he was a bit of a passenger letting the other lads do the hard work.

He turned out to be just as good a commentator as Brady too, so there’s that…

Give me Ollie or Deano any day

Wasn't Deano really a centre who converted to 10? Fabulous player but his kicking skills didn't match those magical hands.

Other way around. Played 10 for St Mary's and the Irish schools. Was moved to 12 as Campbell had the 10 Jersey sown up

Sent from my VOG-L09 using Tapatalk

Deano was a great centre, also a great 10. I’d have him over Ward every day and twice in Sunday

[Oldschoolsocks]

Tony Ward was the rugby equivalent of Liam Brady, undoubted skill and flair with a talent that shone like a thousand suns.

However like Brady, I always felt he was a bit of a passenger letting the other lads do the hard work.

He turned out to be just as good a commentator as Brady too, so there’s that…

Give me Ollie or Deano any day

Ah hear, Liam Brady was Ireland's greatest ever attacking midfielder. He had unprecidented success in England and Italy, he was far a from a passenger. Wardy worked hard, he was a flair player and had a profile in the media because he was good looking and had an opinion - and he played soccer. None of this went down well with the blazers.

He was also up against Campbell and Dean of course.

Without getting into Leinster's great ever outhalf (there's a conversation!), Wardy didn't play that much for us so woulkdn't make the cut on best IQ signing and as someone else said, Ward was born and went to school in Dublin.

The reason Deano and Campbell got picked ahead of Ward is because they were better.

[riocard911]

Did Wardie and Deano not play 10 and 12 together at Mary's at one stage?

I remember the tour to Australia in '79 - no live TV coverage from Down Under back then -, being in the c~*k Tavern in Howth and hearing Ireland had won the first Test and that Ollie had put in a MOTM performance. We were chuffed!!!

[Flash Gordon]

Tony Ward was the rugby equivalent of Liam Brady, undoubted skill and flair with a talent that shone like a thousand suns.

However like Brady, I always felt he was a bit of a passenger letting the other lads do the hard work.

He turned out to be just as good a commentator as Brady too, so there’s that…

Give me Ollie or Deano any day

Ah hear, Liam Brady was Ireland's greatest ever attacking midfielder. He had unprecidented success in England and Italy, he was far a from a passenger. Wardy worked hard, he was a flair player and had a profile in the media because he was good looking and had an opinion - and he played soccer. None of this went down well with the blazers.

He was also up against Campbell and Dean of course.

Without getting into Leinster's great ever outhalf (there's a conversation!), Wardy didn't play that much for us so woulkdn't make the cut on best IQ signing and as someone else said, Ward was born and went to school in Dublin.

The reason Deano and Campbell got picked ahead of Ward is because they were better.

There was more to it than that. Ward had started for the Lions in the season before Dean came in for Ireland. He'd been man of the match 3 times n the 1979 season. However, the IRFU and Noel Murphy in particular didn't like him - even to the extent that when he won the Rugby Writers Player of the Year they forbid him from accepting the award. The guy was phenomenally talented and a brilliant all round athlete (think he's the only Irish sportsman to win championships in Soccer and Rugby) - the media picked up on that plus the fact that he was a good looking lad. That's not to take anything away from Campbell and Dean who were fantastic players who we'd kill to have available today.

[Oldschoolsocks]

Ah hear, Liam Brady was Ireland's greatest ever attacking midfielder. He had unprecidented success in England and Italy, he was far a from a passenger. Wardy worked hard, he was a flair player and had a profile in the media because he was good looking and had an opinion - and he played soccer. None of this went down well with the blazers.

He was also up against Campbell and Dean of course.

Without getting into Leinster's great ever outhalf (there's a conversation!), Wardy didn't play that much for us so woulkdn't make the cut on best IQ signing and as someone else said, Ward was born and went to school in Dublin.

The reason Deano and Campbell got picked ahead of Ward is because they were better.

There was more to it than that. Ward had started for the Lions in the season before Dean came in for Ireland. He'd been man of the match 3 times n the 1979 season. However, the IRFU and Noel Murphy in particular didn't like him - even to the extent that when he won the Rugby Writers Player of the Year they forbid him from accepting the award. The guy was phenomenally talented and a brilliant all round athlete (think he's the only Irish sportsman to win championships in Soccer and Rugby) - the media picked up on that plus the fact that he was a good looking lad. That's not to take anything away from Campbell and Dean who were fantastic players who we'd kill to have available today.

I get it, he had talent to burn. He just wasn't as good as Deano or Ollie. Theres a list of teams who performed better after these superstars were dropped. On that list are the Irish rugby team after Tony Ward was dropped and the Irish soccer team after Liam Brady was dropped.

Talent is only one trait. The ability to get on with your team mates and play to a game plan are just as if not more important…