Leinster exiles, where are they.

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sunshiner1
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by sunshiner1 »

by Serb

Also, his contract appears to be up this summer and he doesn’t look like he’s getting his anew Zealand chance right now, so could be Munster bound after all…
What about Connacht? They need another TH as well. If the IRFU are actually going to help sign him then to my eyes that makes a more logical selection. TBF I can't see him going anywhere.
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munster#1
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by munster#1 »

sunshiner1 wrote: June 19th, 2022, 5:37 am
by Serb

Also, his contract appears to be up this summer and he doesn’t look like he’s getting his anew Zealand chance right now, so could be Munster bound after all…
What about Connacht? They need another TH as well. If the IRFU are actually going to help sign him then to my eyes that makes a more logical selection. TBF I can't see him going anywhere.
Why is Connacht the most logical province for Jager?
As someone who would be a big supporter of Connacht, and someone who would love to see them improve, I would see their lack of HC rugby being a reason why they wouldn’t be the logical selection.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by Blue Man »

He grew up in Leinster and played for Leinster schools. Leinster is the most logical province for him to join.
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Serb
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Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by Serb »

Blue Man wrote:He grew up in Leinster and played for Leinster schools. Leinster is the most logical province for him to join.
Tadhg Beirne grew up in Leinster and went to Leinster schools… if he comes, he’ll go where he’s needed, and that’s not Leinster right now. We already signed the guy who was keeping him out of his team.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by sunshiner1 »

by munster#1

Why is Connacht the most logical province for Jager?
As someone who would be a big supporter of Connacht, and someone who would love to see them improve, I would see their lack of HC rugby being a reason why they wouldn’t be the logical selection.
Because Connacht let 3 TH's go this season and haven't replaced them leaving them with Bealham who will be away on International duty and Illo for all intense purposes a second year academy player and sweet bugger all else.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by berliner »

There's perennial speculation about Jäger and a return to Ireland, but from what I've gleaned from forums over the last year he has always made clear that he wants to stay in NZ, and I think there may be personal reasons (maybe an engagement?) which means that he's tied by more than his All Black ambitions. So there's mo evidence that this may happen, other than the fact that his contract is about to end.

As regards the provinces, Munster obviously feel they need the improvement in quality, and it's true that with the current personnel of the front row, they're not going to win anything. Connacht, however, and this is not based on my provincial preference, have a different problem at TH. We have Bealham, Aungier and Illo. After that, the cupboard is empty. there's no TH in the Academy and the three props who could cover both sides (Robertson-McCoy, Tuimauga, McGrath) have been released/gone elsewhere. Connacht must sign someone as a matter of necessity not luxury.

Does anyone know what the ceiling is in terms of minutes from a player welfare POV? Even if the new schedule is organised so that there are no provincial games during international windows, there will be limits to how much Bealham can play.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by suisse »

neiliog93 wrote: June 18th, 2022, 8:00 pm Scrummaging in Super Rugby, including New Zealand, is generally weak. Weaker than in northern hemisphere club rugby for sure. Ruaidhrí Murphy, who could hardly get a cap at Ulster, was a regular in Super Rugby. Don't think Jager is that good to be honest.
That doesn't make any sense. Not in my lifetime have NZ been considered to have a weak scrum. If Jager is a starting prop for, of all teams, the Crusaders, you can be bloody sure he is that good.

As for Ruaidhri Murphy, Michael Bent went from having a dozen Super Rugby caps to an international. You could find plenty of examples to suit both arguments.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by LeinsterLeader »

Quote from the man himself. Never say never and all that but I think it's pretty clear where his preference lies:

“I think I’ve made it pretty clear in the last couple of years that I want to be an All Black. I’ve put a lot of effort into it, I’ve stayed in New Zealand.

“This is my sixth year in Super Rugby. I feel like I’ve been here long enough that I really feel part of New Zealand and I really feel like I’ve got a lot of friends in the team.

“My whole life’s in New Zealand now, I’ve got a fiance from the South Island and all that kind of stuff so I think I’ve put a lot of effort in and I would love to see myself become an All Black one day.”
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by LeRouxIsPHat »

LeinsterLeader wrote: June 20th, 2022, 2:23 pm Quote from the man himself. Never say never and all that but I think it's pretty clear where his preference lies:

“I think I’ve made it pretty clear in the last couple of years that I want to be an All Black. I’ve put a lot of effort into it, I’ve stayed in New Zealand.

“This is my sixth year in Super Rugby. I feel like I’ve been here long enough that I really feel part of New Zealand and I really feel like I’ve got a lot of friends in the team.

“My whole life’s in New Zealand now, I’ve got a fiance from the South Island and all that kind of stuff so I think I’ve put a lot of effort in and I would love to see myself become an All Black one day.”
You do have to wonder why there's no news of a new contract yet though.

It's funny, I don't think he's any great shakes but the lack of depth at TH could still mean he'd go straight into the Ireland squad and have a great shot at the World Cup squad. I certainly think he'd start for Munster right now. There are lots of talented youngsters but the World Cup could fall into an awkward position where they aren't quite ready or proved themselves enough and he is able to step in and fill the gap for a while. Personally I think Clarkson will explode next season but even if he does he might not play enough games or do it early enough in the season to make the World Cup.

I always feel a bit harsh when I comment on Jager but I don't mean to be, it's just that I think people overrate him a bit because he's Irish. He's improved year on year though and he'd certainly be a great addition to Irish rugby if a deal can be done.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by Colmodon »

Jager has re-signed with Canterbury https://www.canterburyrugby.co.nz/news/ ... -front-row. See here from 16 May this year.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by OTT »

LeRouxIsPHat wrote: June 20th, 2022, 3:09 pm
You do have to wonder why there's no news of a new contract yet though.

It's funny, I don't think he's any great shakes but the lack of depth at TH could still mean he'd go straight into the Ireland squad and have a great shot at the World Cup squad. I certainly think he'd start for Munster right now. There are lots of talented youngsters but the World Cup could fall into an awkward position where they aren't quite ready or proved themselves enough and he is able to step in and fill the gap for a while. Personally I think Clarkson will explode next season but even if he does he might not play enough games or do it early enough in the season to make the World Cup.

I always feel a bit harsh when I comment on Jager but I don't mean to be, it's just that I think people overrate him a bit because he's Irish. He's improved year on year though and he'd certainly be a great addition to Irish rugby if a deal can be done.

I totally agree with you. I also think if Crusaders had of lost the game at the weekend there would be less talk about him but he’d still be the exact same player, I haven’t read anything about him this season prior to Saturday, seems like lazy journalists going for the cheap story and it being lapped up by people who’ve probably never heard of him before.

I do think someone should have taken a punt on him 3 years ago (if that was an option from his point of view) but he seems like he’s chasing his dream. I’m sure Leinster didn’t go after AIL players like Abdeladze and McGrath or bring in a guy like Salanoa who was a total novice if they could have brought back a guy like Jager who would have been on cheap money at the time and Munster surely would have tried to bring him there being IQ rather than just robbing Salanoa from us at the time. So it seems like he just isn’t that interested in coming back.

Really looking forward to seeing Clarkson get better in the coming season and Abdeladze being backed to start a few games, there’s no point keeping him around all these years otherwise.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by LeRouxIsPHat »

Colmodon wrote: June 20th, 2022, 3:32 pm Jager has re-signed with Canterbury https://www.canterburyrugby.co.nz/news/ ... -front-row. See here from 16 May this year.
Ah, that's a different story then, thanks. I'd seen people mention him being out of contract on twitter and didn't see anything since 2020 when I checked myself to make sure but that settles it then.

It sounds like he's very happy over there but I do wonder if he expected to make the NZ squad this summer when he signed that.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by hugonaut »

OTT wrote: June 20th, 2022, 3:49 pm
Really looking forward to seeing Clarkson get better in the coming season and Abdeladze being backed to start a few games, there’s no point keeping him around all these years otherwise.
Vakh has been in the Leinster system for a long time. He did three years in the sub-academy before going into the academy. That's a seriously tough route to come through given that the sub-academy is unpaid.

He's in a very unusual situation for a Leinster player in that he is 26 and hasn't started a game for us. He had a bad back injury and with the pandemic he missed a a lot of time on the pitch – he didn't play between October 2019 and June 2021. He's still an unknown quantity, which [again] is unusual for a player his age.

On the positive side of the ledger, you've got his very good size at 188cm and 121kg. His old man was a Georgian international. He's 26 now and has been in the Leinster system for seven years [going from sub-academy onwards], so he's got a lot of S&C under his belt. He might be able to hit the ground running, because a lot of props – maybe most props – are better in their late 20s than their early 20s. They're stronger and calmer.

Against that, he has played very little pro rugby. He still might be relatively low on the learning curve. It's difficult to tell. It'd be ideal if he was able to come in and pin down a scrum on the tighthead side, like you see from the Georgians scattered across the Top14. Just scrummaging first and everything else as a bonus. If he's a 25-30 minute player, so be it. You see these lads in the Top14 coming off the bench like Kakovin, Chilichava, Nariashvili etc. and all they do is scrummage.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by neiliog93 »

I shouldn't say New Zealand scrummaging is 'weak', but it's typically not as good as in England, South Africa, France, Argentina, even Italy when they're strong. Our scrum has been better than New Zealand's for some time now as well. Contrast that with their dominance of many other areas of play in world rugby.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by Ruckedtobits »

hugonaut wrote: June 20th, 2022, 6:28 pm
OTT wrote: June 20th, 2022, 3:49 pm
Really looking forward to seeing Clarkson get better in the coming season and Abdeladze being backed to start a few games, there’s no point keeping him around all these years otherwise.
Vakh has been in the Leinster system for a long time. He did three years in the sub-academy before going into the academy. That's a seriously tough route to come through given that the sub-academy is unpaid.

He's in a very unusual situation for a Leinster player in that he is 26 and hasn't started a game for us. He had a bad back injury and with the pandemic he missed a a lot of time on the pitch – he didn't play between October 2019 and June 2021. He's still an unknown quantity, which [again] is unusual for a player his age.

On the positive side of the ledger, you've got his very good size at 188cm and 121kg. His old man was a Georgian international. He's 26 now and has been in the Leinster system for seven years [going from sub-academy onwards], so he's got a lot of S&C under his belt. He might be able to hit the ground running, because a lot of props – maybe most props – are better in their late 20s than their early 20s. They're stronger and calmer.

Against that, he has played very little pro rugby. He still might be relatively low on the learning curve. It's difficult to tell. It'd be ideal if he was able to come in and pin down a scrum on the tighthead side, like you see from the Georgians scattered across the Top14. Just scrummaging first and everything else as a bonus. If he's a 25-30 minute player, so be it. You see these lads in the Top14 coming off the bench like Kakovin, Chilichava, Nariashvili etc. and all they do is scrummage.
Totally agree. He's a player who has missed out big time on the absence of A games.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by ronk »

I'd guess that the back injury affected fitness and has needed management. Sometimes a few games are what is needed once you reach a certain stage of recovery.

He lost out hugely with that injury, it was timed incredibly badly. Aungier left and things were looking good, Salanoa suddenly left and he was going to get loads of chances. Furlong was also out long term. Leinster really could have done with him. Rotten, rotten luck.

There's a power dynamism to him, this season he gave one of the most powerful handoff I've seen in years. If he's fit for the right times he might get some action.

But he could as easily struggle with injury and be retiring at the end of the year.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by hugonaut »

ronk wrote: June 20th, 2022, 11:31 pm I'd guess that the back injury affected fitness and has needed management. Sometimes a few games are what is needed once you reach a certain stage of recovery.

He lost out hugely with that injury, it was timed incredibly badly. Aungier left and things were looking good, Salanoa suddenly left and he was going to get loads of chances. Furlong was also out long term. Leinster really could have done with him. Rotten, rotten luck.

There's a power dynamism to him, this season he gave one of the most powerful handoff I've seen in years. If he's fit for the right times he might get some action.

But he could as easily struggle with injury and be retiring at the end of the year.
Vakh's progress next season [with the big proviso that he is fit and healthy] will be a good indicator of how well McBride is doing with the scrum. As I wrote above, Vakh is a big unit, has good rugby pedigree, isn't a nipper anymore ... he should be able to be competitive in the scrum at league and cup level if he is well coached.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by LeRouxIsPHat »

Just to ruin Hugo's evening, Conor Nash has extended his deal until 2024. If we hadn't already done so then I think we can officially put that one to bed.
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by hugonaut »

LeRouxIsPHat wrote: June 21st, 2022, 7:17 pm Just to ruin Hugo's evening, Conor Nash has extended his deal until 2024. If we hadn't already done so then I think we can officially put that one to bed.
From what I gather he turned the corner at the end of last season and is doing pretty well for Hawthorn this season. I believe he has changed position and it has made a big difference. Very good article/interview with him here by Maurice Brosnan: https://www.the42.ie/conor-nash-3-5782466-Jun2022/
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Re: Leinster exiles, where are they.

Post by TMC »

LeRouxIsPHat wrote: June 20th, 2022, 3:50 pm
Colmodon wrote: June 20th, 2022, 3:32 pm Jager has re-signed with Canterbury https://www.canterburyrugby.co.nz/news/ ... -front-row. See here from 16 May this year.
Ah, that's a different story then, thanks. I'd seen people mention him being out of contract on twitter and didn't see anything since 2020 when I checked myself to make sure but that settles it then.

It sounds like he's very happy over there but I do wonder if he expected to make the NZ squad this summer when he signed that.
I was under the impression when Ala'alatoa was signed Leinster's initial approach was to sound Canterbury / Jagger out about a return home, it wasn’t of interest; but the Ala'alatoa signing was the upshot of those conversations. Think OJ decided where his future lay a couple of seasons ago tbh.
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