Rumour Mill

[neiliog93]

I'd be very disappointed if the €425 k figure for Toulon's offer to SOB is true. Our best-paid players are on around that from the IRFU, surely he should be one of them? I was expecting it to be closer to the €600 k + figure we were looking at with Sexton (in which case his departure would be more understandable). I suppose we just don't know enough concrete facts to comment authoritatively yet.

[ronk]

The (unofficial, unwritten, ephemeral) overseas premium is the best defence the IRFU have. Preserve that and we can manage. If Toulon have to pay that premium (generously), they don't alert other clubs to vulnerability here. O'Brien is special, he's the only Leinster player that Munster trolls actually like and who they never have a bad word to say about.

As I think you are pointing out they did their best to undermine that with Sexton. That was their strategy. Make them worth less abroad.

O'Brien is special. So is Healy. So was Sexton. I don't know what the trolls have to do with it. He's relentlessly patronised outside leinster as some kind of farm dwelling simpleton/yokel. It's kind of funny the person they have to invent him into in order to justify their hatred of some of the others.

That also makes him marketable to a wider section of the Irish rugby public than was possible with Sexton or Heaslip.

[simonokeeffe]

real danger is if IRFU see the team of Tommy Bowes pay off it snowballs
successful provinces are hugely important for growing the game (and paying for it) eg look at all the Leinster merch you see everywhere, I would say provinces get more people playing some form of game than national side

@golfman St Joe said longterm Jordi was a 7

[Logorrhea]

We had five truly world class players in Leinster. We lost Isa and Johnny last year, are in serious danger of losing Sean and BOD this year, and you just know if Cian wanted to move he'd be offered a ridiculous salary abroad.

The IRFU cant serious accept that all of them have to go.

[mikey]

We had five truly world class players in Leinster. We lost Isa and Johnny last year, are in serious danger of losing Sean and BOD this year, and you just know if Cian wanted to move he'd be offered a ridiculous salary abroad.

The IRFU cant serious accept that all of them have to go.

Nothing has yet demonstrated their desire to do otherwise - this is a key point in time now with their choices on Jamie and Seanie....

[deco]

What?
No new rumour yet today?

No-one saw Heaslip in a café in Ranalagh reading Le Monde?

SOB's Aunty Mary didn't tweet that she's looking forward to a holiday in France later in the year?

Ah well, I'll have to read the Sabre Rattling thread over my sandwich to see the latest ramblings so....

[simonokeeffe]

Carlow for Sam

[TerenureJim]

Carlow for Sam

Rumour is that as part of the SOB deal Carlow will move en masse to the Cote D'Azur and compete from abroad a la NY or London the previso is that on top of agreeing terms with his agent and SOB the contact with Toulon must also go before the GAA in Congress.

[[Jackass]]

Carlow have tabled an offer for SOB to play in the coming All Ireland.

Racing Post reporting it's a done deal.

[Dublinner]

For what its worth heard today from a decent source that SOB has done the Toulon deal. That it is worth close to €650k.

[jauzy19]

Heaslip and SOB to sign for Toulon in the coming days.

http://www.laprovence.com/actu/sports-e ... brien.html

[goreyguy]

If both go, leinster team will look like this at the start of next season?

1. Healy[26]
2. Strauss[28]
3. Moore[23]
4. McCarthy[32]
5. Toner[28]
6. Ruddock[23]
7. Jennings[33]
8. Murphy[23]
9. Reddan[33]
10. Gopperth[31]/Madigan[25]
11. Kearney[25]
12. Darcy[34]
13. Fitzgerald[26]
14. McFadden[28]
15. Kearney[28]

[dw7]

If both go, leinster team will look like this at the start of next season?

1. Healy[26]
2. Strauss[28]
3. Moore[23]
4. McCarthy[32]
5. Toner[28]
6. Ruddock[23]
7. Jennings[33]
8. Murphy[23]
9. Reddan[33]
10. Gopperth[31]/Madigan[25]
11. Kearney[25]
12. Darcy[34]
13. Fitzgerald[26]
14. McFadden[28]
15. Kearney[28]

No place for Kirchner on the wing?
How do you guys in Leinster rate his contribution so far?

[goreyguy]

If both go, leinster team will look like this at the start of next season?

1. Healy[26]
2. Strauss[28]
3. Moore[23]
4. McCarthy[32]
5. Toner[28]
6. Ruddock[23]
7. Jennings[33]
8. Murphy[23]
9. Reddan[33]
10. Gopperth[31]/Madigan[25]
11. Kearney[25]
12. Darcy[34]
13. Fitzgerald[26]
14. McFadden[28]
15. Kearney[28]

No place for Kirchner on the wing?
How do you guys in Leinster rate his contribution so far?

Possibly but i'd pick an Irish player over a NIQ every day. He would be primary backup at both wing positions and fullback imo.

He has been decent so far but nothing great, although that might be down to the poor back play in general.

[[Jackass]]

Ah I don't know about that. I think Dave Kearney is a very good player, as is McFadden, but I think Kirchner would edge for me to the 14 jersey. Not by much mind, it's a close call between all of them, but on ability and form alone, I'd favour Kirchner. I don't think there's room for IRFU agenda all over the place, I think we need our best team out first and foremost, considering said team will never comprise of more than 3 or 4 NIQ players at a max (but mostly consists of 13 or 14 IQ players and has done and will do for a long time) there's no harm in playing some quality imports.

Let's face it, we're no Munster or Ulster, but we can't produce EVERY player in EVERY position (for us alone, let alone for them *ahem* howyra Limerick), I think supplementing our side with one or two quality imports is important.

[neiliog93]

If both go, leinster team will look like this at the start of next season?

1. Healy[26]
2. Strauss[28]
3. Moore[23]
4. McCarthy[32]
5. Toner[28]
6. Ruddock[23]
7. Jennings[33]
8. Murphy[23]
9. Reddan[33]
10. Gopperth[31]/Madigan[25]
11. Kearney[25]
12. Darcy[34]
13. Fitzgerald[26]
14. McFadden[28]
15. Kearney[28]

Cronin ahead of Strauss based on this season's form. His throwing is much improved and Strauss had shown a few wobbles in that area also. I don't blame Cronin for the scrum problems, it's clearly the Leinster scrum's tactic to generally not strike for the ball for fear of being driven off the ball while temporarily reduced to a 7-man shove. Jennings' experience will be very important, but I wouldn't start him. His impact off the bench has been excellent but with his years advancing I'd go for this selection: Kev 6, Jordi 7 and Ruddock 8, Jennings 20.

I know everyone sees Luke as the successor to BOD at 13, and I see why. He has the skills/size necessary. However, technically he's an excellent winger and wing/fullback are his stated first positions. Ferg, on the other hand, had barely played wing until a couple of seasons ago. His first position is 12 but he can also play 13. He's slightly shorter but heavier than Fiztgerald and is a little bit more physical. I also think his passing is that little bit better. For those reasons, I'd have Ferg at 13, and Luke on the wing. Other than that, I can't disagree with the team you've selected. I still think Ross is marginally ahead of Moore now, largely based on his experience, but will have been usurped by next season.

[neiliog93]

If both go, leinster team will look like this at the start of next season?

1. Healy[26]
2. Strauss[28]
3. Moore[23]
4. McCarthy[32]
5. Toner[28]
6. Ruddock[23]
7. Jennings[33]
8. Murphy[23]
9. Reddan[33]
10. Gopperth[31]/Madigan[25]
11. Kearney[25]
12. Darcy[34]
13. Fitzgerald[26]
14. McFadden[28]
15. Kearney[28]

No place for Kirchner on the wing?
How do you guys in Leinster rate his contribution so far?

Kirchner has done well save for one or two defensive wobbles. He's more physical than I expected, and his kicking has also exceeded my expectations. Nothing special in attack, but then again we didn't expect to be. Still, couldn't call him a blunt knife either. He's been solid overall. I think DK and Luke offer slightly more than him overall, are younger, and are Irish qualified. Ergo they start and Kirchner gets the 23 jersey.

[goreyguy]

Strauss has always been ahead of Cronin can't see that changing unless he struggles mightily returning.
Ruddock isn't an 8, he can cover there but his natural position is 6. Think that has been very clear this season. Murphy fits there better currently. Kev's form has been poor and personally I think we are currently a far better side with Ruddock at 6. Long term I could see Conan coming in at 8 and Murphy shifting to 7. But next year it's clear that Murphy is our best choice at 8.
Think Fitz is a better passer and is more suited to 13 than McFadden, McFadden has been in tremendous form on the wing and I personally think he is either a wing or Darcy's replacement at 12. Not to mention Fitz has publicly stated his long term aim is to play 13 after BOD.

[neiliog93]

Strauss has always been ahead of Cronin can't see that changing unless he struggles mightily returning.
Ruddock isn't an 8, he can cover there but his natural position is 6. Think that has been very clear this season. Murphy fits there better currently. Kev's form has been poor and personally I think we are currently a far better side with Ruddock at 6. Long term I could see Conan coming in at 8 and Murphy shifting to 7. But next year it's clear that Murphy is our best choice at 8.
Think Fitz is a better passer and is more suited to 13 than McFadden, McFadden has been in tremendous form on the wing and I personally think he is either a wing or Darcy's replacement at 12. Not to mention Fitz has publicly stated his long term aim is to play 13 after BOD.

Don't think Kev has been poor at all. He was bad against Castres but was returning from injury and was off the pace as a result. He was Joe's sub option for the All Blacks game and did very well after coming on. He has played well for Leinster generally this season. One bad game when returning from injury with a couple of quiet ones doesn't equal 'poor'. He's been very good in most of the games he's played this season. He's one of the only players on our team who consistently hits hard defensively. We have a lot of aggressive ball-carriers but they don't seem to replicate this as much in defence. Kev does. He's also a great line-out option, especially important with 6'4" Mike McCarthy in the second-row.

I agree re Ruddock but he's played well at 8 in the past and Joe sees Jordi as a 7, so I do too. His physique and playing style are more suited to it in the long-term. For me, accommodating Kev and keeping Jordi at 7 is worth putting Ruddock at 8. He's a skilful player and a powerful call carrier anyway, should cope fine. I also agree with you re Conan, he's a beast of a boy and a true modern 8 - definitely our starter in the long-term there, but not for a couple of seasons yet. Don't think he's even made his first team debut yet (could be wrong). By say, 2016, our backrow may be 6 Ruddock 7 Jordi 8 Conan 20D.Ryan but this is for next season. I agree with you again re McFadden, he's been excellent on the wing but his best position is 12, followed by 13. I really like Luke as a winger too. It's a tight call and we differ on it but I see your logic. D'Arcy's been in good form and his experience will be crucial next year, so he needs to start. After that, I can see the logic of putting Ferg at 12 and Fitzy at 13, for sure.

Strauss has been ahead of Cronin, yes, but Cronin has been excellent this season. As I explained already, I don't think the scrum issues are his fault. I don't like the idea of dropping the man in possession of the jersey if he's playing well, so I'd make the tight call of keeping him ahead of Strauss. Tight call it certainly is though!

[goreyguy]

Kev has been poor in his 3 appearances since that NZ game, this could be down to carrying an injury, but he has been comfortably outperformed by Ruddock this season. Obviously not writing him off but he will be 30 at the start of next season and probably has reached his peak. So for that reason I can see Ruddock being first choice 6, with Murphy at 8 and a combo of Jennings/Ryan at 7. Ruddock is actually a very good lineout operator too as I believe hugo has written about before. Plus I just don't see him as a natural 8.